Irish Times debate on abortion!

by 57%43% Sat Jul 14, 2007 15:03

The 18+ pages of debate are not very gripping, someone should change the hymn sheet.
if you want to have your say, its speaker's corner at Hyde Park for the Next few hours.

http://www.ireland.com/head2head/yes.html

by immaterial. Fri Jul 13, 2007 17:55

The numbers don't matter , the level of shite in the debate does. If one trawls the comments
one sees such things as;-

'I am catholic and therefore i will protect the life of the unborn at any cost'
'I would never vote for abortion'

Two things;-

I am catholic and have not given my independence of thought to a priest or a dogmatic
system of expedient rhetoric.

This is not about a referendum but ensuring that the abortion issue is 'legislated'
for, the issue of legislation is quite simple. It is not a plebiscite but an allowance
in law for the human right of abortion in the context of an unviable foetus. Of
course this goes in tandem with the issue of the private relationship between
a woman/child and her doctor /gynaecologist and is really nothing to do with
the Irish Taoiseach, his fruitful daughter and his ex-wife who does not appear
in the publicity photos holding her grandchildren.

by answer Fri Jul 13, 2007 16:36

try looking at the clips on youtube , that'll give you an idea of the attendance

by Johnathan Tue Jul 10, 2007 23:08

Okay will someone who was actually in town please clarify how many people were at this rally.
I've heard every figure under the sun; 4000, 800, 2500, 400 and even that Molesworth Street was closed off to let them have their rally.
So what figure do I believe, I can only find one photo on indymedia, are there any more out there?

by barra Tue Jul 10, 2007 12:51

The term Pro-Life is a bullpro dichotomy. The term "Pro-Life" is a lingistic piece of propaganda which sets up the false choice between being for life and against it.

The phrase "pro-life" appeals to the sacared concept of life, and has the effect of castings Pro Choice thinking people as anti-life, in fact pro death. In the battle of words, "life" easily wins out over "choice".

Debunk this Unspeak term "Pro-Life" it dishonest, not very Christian yeh????

by Apparat - ISN - p.c. Mon Jul 09, 2007 23:44

The anti-woman march seemed to stop outside the Irish Times building the other day. I was trailing off with my Leninist comrade Cogz at that stage. He ventured that it was a protest by the every sperm is sacred crowd against the Evil Fintan O'Toole and godless liberals in the media. More likely they stopped to allow the Nora Batty contingent to knock back a few angina pills after 150 yards of Youth Defense deployed cock-rock.

by Martin's Bro Mon Jul 09, 2007 22:49

Hopefully these pictures will tell the true story of how many attended the Demo last Saturday.

Picture of the Demo

by delete Mon Jul 09, 2007 21:57

The woman's role in society was celebrated by youth defence, who else can provide the
necessary raw materials for perpetuation of the Irish genetic pool but women, they love
women and the women who came out on Saturday obviously love their sacred and
daresay cultish role of opening their legs for the men folk. it is as it should be.
No homosexuality. no mixed race relationships and no pleasure from sex unless the
man in white says so. Of course heightening pleasure would require that condoms
would not be handed out because they interfere in the creative 'mechanism'.
This is obvious from the lack of necessity for either divorce or contraception and the
high marriage rate. Abortion is wrong because quite simply put it interferes in the sacred
and private duty of every Irish person to have safe and legal sex as much as is humanly
possible. There are many pamphlets and books on achieving eros within a relationship
and these should be disemminated to all right thinking people in order to have them
understand the sanctity of the sexual relationship. I suggest YD go on tour all over
the country and give workshops on mutual masturbation, sexual positions and
achieving orgasm. These can be held in small hotels and limited in participation
to achieve maximum audience participation. I am offering to give a lecture on
fellating and uses of a vibrator in a consensual relationship.

by gurgle Mon Jul 09, 2007 21:34

were they giving out free condoms?

by Don Mon Jul 09, 2007 21:03

Didnt see it on the TV.

by sinead - pro life Mon Jul 09, 2007 20:52

wow rosa were you standin there on o connell bridge, calculator in hand?
i was at the rally, and tv3 news on saturday reported over 2 and a half thousand people attended and filled the entire length of molesworth street outside the dail! to quote: "brought dublin city centre to a standstill"!!
i dunno either there was a hell of a lot of people there or just 400 hundred extremely large pro lifers
the rally shows the amount of irish people willing to motivate themselves to work together against abortion and it was a fantastic day

by stan of the judean peoples' front Mon Jul 09, 2007 17:41

It is interesting the delay there has been in formulating an attendence at the event which if we remember had something to do with distribution of a pamphlet urging people not to copy the UK on aborting mentally or physically handicapped foetuses. No debate on state or other social support to women who give birth to people with serious problems like that - no debate on the level of funding, no appeals to adopt such offspring, just a pause in which numbers were inflated - and then frankly dreary observation that 'tis men with or without ornaments or statues who flock to these "pro-life" rallies. Let them have gestate!
Anyway indications are that "pro-choice" rally attendence is now inflated to 400. Whilst elsewhere 2.7 milion people collapsed roads in the Goffs area as they went to Poxyegen.

The Saatchi & Saatchi unwanted Pregnancy Poster which turned the tide in the UK - men have been gestating since.

by Rosa Mon Jul 09, 2007 17:04

YD claim 2,000. I saw 400 on the demo. Most of them seemed to over the age of 50.

by DR Mon Jul 09, 2007 16:58

More men have contibuted to debate. However thats doest mean more men have voted in the polls.

I'm pro-life/Youth Defnce. I never argue using the bible as a point. Someone posted there where 2,000 people at the pro-life rallly. Interesting.

by 68-32% Mon Jul 09, 2007 16:45

The links are working, have just been in. Women are more literal than men in their interpretation of scripture,
thats why the church has lasted so long. This is a sample of a comment:-
"I am a Catholic and therefore I believe that the right to life of the unborn should be saved at all costs'.

Can someone please translate that into English ?
What does it mean?
It is laziness personified and the level of debate on the head 2head site-The sample comment was made by a woman.
it is a typical fundamental and uneducated reaction to an issue that deserves more resource and intelligence,but it
is indicative of the refusal to look maturely at issues of right to privacy in a medical situation that really has nothing
to do with the theological imperative. YD know how to reduce an argument and they have turned their sophisticated
lobby towards reducing and obfuscating what could be a worthwhile debate on the issues.

by DR Mon Jul 09, 2007 16:38

The links arent working. Its a myth that all pro-lifers are women. Most people I met in Youth Defence are women.