Minutes of North East Irish Social Forum Meeting + IAWM Call Public Meeting

by Richard Boyd Barret - IAWM Fri Aug 08, 2003 18:02 info at irishantiwar dot org 087 6329511

IRISH ANTI WAR MOVEMENT

INVITATION TO MOBILISING MEETING FOR THE SECOND EUROPEAN SOCIAL FORUM

Saturday August 19th 2pm, Wynn’s Hotel, Lower Abbey St, Dublin.


Dear Friend(s),

The second European Social Forum will take place this November 12-15 in Paris, St Denis. I am writing to invite you to a mobilising meeting for this crucial event in the calendar of European social and peace movements.

As I sure you are aware the first ESF in Florence last year was an assembly of historic importance where 65,000 delegates from across Europe and the world attended the Forum and one million people marched against the planned war on Iraq. It was at the ESF that the call was raised for the February 15th global day of action against war that brought tens of millions onto the streets against the Iraq war earlier this year.

This year’s second ESF is likely to be a meeting of equally vital importance where key decisions will be made about the next steps in the campaign against war and neo-liberal globalisation across Europe. Tens of thousands of delegates will attend the four days of the ESF representing NGO’s, trade unions, campaign groups, environmentalists and many others from across the continent. There will also be a major political demonstration on Saturday November 15th to conclude the ESF which is likely to see hundreds of thousands in attendance to protest against neo-liberalism and war.

As a delegate for the Irish Anti War Movement, I recently attended the preparatory meeting in Genoa for the ESF where the details of the event are organised by representatives of participating organisations across Europe. (A full report on the Genoa preparatory Assembly will available on our website.) At a recent national meeting the IAWM agreed to host a meeting here in Ireland to bring together all groups and organisations in this country who might be interested in mobilising for the ESF.

Although the IAWM is hosting this initial meeting, the aim is to establish a self-standing mobilising group for the ESF that will then take on responsibility for the Irish mobilisation to Paris.

The Irish Anti War Movement is, of course, particularly concerned with issues relating to the military aspects of neo-liberal globalisation. However, the ESF is a gathering of a much wider variety of forces concerned with issues of trade, third world development, the environment, privatisation, poverty, social exclusion and global justice issues generally. So we hope groups and individuals from the broad diversity of NGO’s, trade unions and social movements will attend this meeting and get involved this year’s ESF.

The meeting should be 2-3 hours in duration, shorter if possible. If you have any further queries or questions please contact me at 087-6329511.

Looking forward to seeing you and/or representatives of your organisation at the meeting.

Yours Sincerely,

Richard Boyd Barrett, on behalf the IAWM.

by Ray Fri Aug 08, 2003 18:09

The European Social Forum (ESF) is (presumably) part of the World Social Forum (WSF). The Irish Social Forum (ISF) is the Irish part of the WSF. One of the member groups of the ISF is Globalise Resistance (GR), and one (!) of the member groups of GR is the Socialist Workers Party (SWP). With me so far? Good.

So why has an SWP member of the Irish Anti War Movement (IAWM) issued the call for organisation around the ESF?
Surely RBB from the SWP should have used GR to call for the ISF to issue a call to mobilise for the ESF (N12)? Or has someone's acronym generator broken down?

by Seáinín Fri Aug 08, 2003 18:15

Why don't you people stop thinking about waht you are all AGAINST and concentrate on what you are FOR.

It always works much better when there are specific goals to be achieved. Otherwise, the situation remains as it is - ordinary people looking at small crowds in the streets wondering what exactly these people stand for.

It's all very clear that you are against war and against the existence United States, but what can your alternatives (if any) do for ordinary people?

by Anonymous Fri Aug 08, 2003 18:26

I take your point Seanin. Just be sure that it is the ordinary people, and particularly the disadvanted people of both Ireland & the world that are at the centre of left wing / humanitarian politics.

Capitalism & neo-liberal politics favours the rich & the advantaged people of the world, who generate their revenue & power from the sweat & blood of ordinary & disadvantaged people of the world.

by Anonymous Fri Aug 08, 2003 18:36

I think you are correct on your connections between the various organizations in your first paragraph.

However, I fail how to see how this presents a problem or what it has got to do with the IAWM issueing a call for organisation around the ESF?
I am assuming the IAWM is also part of the ISF or at least very supportive of the ISF (& ESF) - so I don't see what the problem is in it calling for this meeting.

by Sebastian Wheatabix Fri Aug 08, 2003 18:50

Are Richard Boyde Barret and co. trying to sideline the Irish Social Forum?

The ISF has had a long string of successful meetings over the past year bringing NGO groups together. See http://www.indymedia.ie/index.php?topic_id=8

Its a relatively small country and alternative scene so Richard and the IAWM must know this. So why are they ignoring the ISF and trying to organise ANOTHER group to represent Ireland at the ESF?

Something stinks here.

by Anonymous Fri Aug 08, 2003 19:43

On re-reading the IAWM's call for a meeting, I just want to re-evaluate what I said.

Ideally, it is the ISF who should be calling for this meeting but failing this if the IAWM wish to try and organize increased Irish mobilization for Paris, I think this can only be a good thing.

Every group & organization should be trying to do what they can to increase mobilization.

by Barry Finnegan - on behalf of ISF Communications Working Group Sun Aug 10, 2003 22:31 john.finnegan3 at mail dot dcu dot ie

I post the following in the interests of hopefully promoting dialogue and communication within and between progressive social forces on this island actively engaged in building a more democratic and egalitarian world and regarding participation from the island in next Novembers Paris ESF.

The following is an extracted section from the latest ISF update email sent to the all-island ISF elist, as it relates to this topic of the IAWM public meeting called for Sat. Aug 23rd:

(Extract:)
- (1) DOC ONE:

IAWM Calls Public Meeting To Decide The Three Representatives From Ireland To The Nov. 2003 European Social Forum and to Mobilise Participation in the ESF.

The Irish Anti War Movement (IAWM) sent a representative to the European Social Forum (ESF) Planning Assembly in Genoa in early July. This gathering was to continue preparation and plans for the 2nd ESF taking place next November in Paris. At this meeting:

(a) Ireland was allocated a total of three speakers for the Plenary meetings of the Paris ESF,

(b) Ireland was allocated one representative on a new ESF Working Group which will decide the final details of the 250 Seminars of November ESF.

The IAWM has called a public meeting for Sat. Aug 23rd 2003, 2pm, Wynns Hotel, Abbey St., Dublin 1, in order to mobilise people from Ireland to attend the Paris ESF and to address issues (a) and (b) above. The IAWM has asked in their invitation that as many groups, organisations and movements as possible be represented at this public meeting.

Attendees at last Thursdays weekly Dublin based ISF working group meeting were informed of this news. After some discussion on the issue it was decided to send representatives to meet some of the Steering Committee of the IAWM. This meeting will take palace next Tuesday 12th Aug. 2003 at 6.30 pm in Cultivate Sustainable Living Centre. The representatives from the Dublin based ISF working group meeting will be reporting back to next Thursdays ISF meeting. Any points or issues which any of you would like raised at Tuesdays ISF reps-IAWM meeting please reply to this email by 5pm on Tuesday. (more details contained in DOC TWO below:) The IAWM document: Setting up a group to mobilise for the ESF - INVITATION TO MOBILISING MEETING FOR THE SECOND EUROPEAN SOCIAL FORUM can be accessed on Indymedia at:
http://www.indymedia.ie/newswire.php?story_id=60700&topic_id=8
it just below the Minutes of the North East Irish Social Forum Meeting of July 22nd , posted on Aug. 8th.

(Extract:)

(2) DOC TWO:
Thur. Aug. 7th 2003, Minutes of ISF Co-Operation and Solidarity Summit Working Group.

[...]

[Point] 4. European Social Forum :

Rory Hearne e-mailed the ISF, suggesting this be placed on the agenda.

Barry Finnegan reported that the next major meeting of the European Social Forum takes place in Paris on November 12-15. There will be 55 plenaries, and 250 workshops.

The next planning meeting is in September.

Recently two people from Ireland attended an ESF meeting – Mark Kahn ( a member of Labour Party Youth) and Richard Boyd-Barrett (who represented the Irish Anti-War Movement). Both had been in touch with BF, and had undertaken to write up reports which would be placed on the Irish Social Forum website.

Ireland was allocated 1 seat on a working group which will plan the next ESF event, and Richard Boyd-Barrett was nominated to this post (he was the only person present who could take on this role).

The meeting was informed that the IAWM had called a meeting – to be held on Saturday August 23 @ Wynn’s Hotel @ 2.00pm – with the following purpose :

”At a recent national meeting the IAWM agreed to host a meeting here in Ireland to bring together all groups and organisations in this country who might be interested in mobilising for the ESF.
Although the IAWM is hosting this initial meeting, the aim is to establish a self-standing mobilising group for the ESF that will then take on responsibility for the Irish mobilisation to Paris.”

A discussion took place on what attitude the Irish Social Forum should take to this suggestion. Different views were aired; concerns were raised why this initiative had not been discussed beforehand within the Irish Social Forum. It was agreed not to take any immediate decision, and volunteers were asked to seek a meeting with the IAWM as soon as possible. Barry Finnegan, Willy Cumming and Clare Lee agreed to seek such a meeting, and to report back to the next Irish Social Forum meeting.

In the meantime other regional Irish Social Forum groups, supporters, and affiliates will be asked for their opinions.

It was also agreed that it would be a good idea to include basic information about the European Social Forum on our website, and to incorporate material about the European Social Forum in the event we are planning for October 17-19.
======================

by anon Mon Aug 11, 2003 02:47

Let me get this straight. Richard Boyd Barret, a SWP leader and key figure in the IAWM, has called a meeting of the IAWM to choose Irish representation to the European Social Forum *without* even discussing it with the Irish Social Forum first.

That's a bit odd, isn't it?

I notice that *nowhere* in Boyd Barret's letter does he even mention the Irish Social Forum.

Is the SWP trying to hijack the Irish Social Forum or at least hijack the democratic process that the ISF represents?

Just curious.

by Badman Mon Aug 11, 2003 03:05

"Ireland was allocated 1 seat on a working group which will plan the next ESF event, and Richard Boyd-Barrett was nominated to this post"

The one delegate from Ireland has already been chosen, before the meeting of the mobilising group!!! Now that really beggars belief. Has RBB had anything to do with the ISF? I mean c'mon SWP, run your fronts with a bit of subtlety at least.

by E Mon Aug 11, 2003 10:41

..that sentence finishes "..he was the only person present who could take on this role". One of the worst traditions in politics (particularly left politics) is the use of the misquote. When you read thought the ESF report back, there had been a push to get Ireland 4 seats (up from the original 2). I think the whole point of the meeting on the 25th is to fairly represent the movement in Ireland with these 3 official seats. Would of liked to got the 4 of course.

And yes before anyone gets too excited, I am a member of the SWP ;)

by Ray Mon Aug 11, 2003 11:31

Why is the IAWM doing all this, and not the ISF?

Why was the ESF meeting attended by people from Labour Youth and the IAWM, rather than someone from the ISF (or even from GR, which sent someone to the last such meeting)? How did that happen? Did the ESF contact RBB/the IAWM and invite them to send someone along? If so, why didn't the IAWM pass the invite along to the ISF? Or GR? (And why would the ESF contact the IAWM, rather than GR, who sent the last delegate?)
Or did RBB/the IAWM contact the ESF and ask for an invitation? Why - surely this is more relevant to the ISF (and GR)? Why didn't the ISF do that?
And why did the IAWM call the meeting on its own, instead of contacting the other relevant groups and calling a joint meeting?

I'm sure I'll be accused of 'red-baiting', McCarthyism, or witch-hunting for saying so, but this is all more than a little dodgy.

by John Meehan Mon Aug 11, 2003 11:43

I agreee with Ray's comments above.

by Anonymous Mon Aug 11, 2003 12:26

The ISF is only getting off the ground at the moment, and this is one of the main reasons I reckon, why everything is not going through it at the moment.

But we must all aim to make it thy central body for the future which most things are channeled through.

In this regard, I think the IAWM needs to make more of an effort to do this.

The ISF needs to become as broad as possible with no one group dominating it.

The ISF should become Ireland's link to bring all of us together in Ireland, and link us to Europe and the World - with this unity & strength, capitalism & neo-liberal politics will finally be brought down.

by E Mon Aug 11, 2003 12:29

Why didn't the ISF itself request an invitation to attend the Genoa meeting? I'm sure you should ask them yourself.

Or is it that another coalition took the initiative to organise a meeting itself (inviting all possible relevant groups to it- this was the whole point) from which a genuinely representative mobilising committee should be formed to get a good Irish delegation to Paris.

by Ray Mon Aug 11, 2003 12:39

The questions above are directed at them as much as at RBB/SWP/IAWM/GR. I think there are three groups which are potentially at fault here, depending on whether invitations were issued or had to be requested
The ISF for not being organised enough to request an invitation
The ESF for issuing invitations to the wrong people, since both the ISF and GR have better claims on an invite than the IAWM.
RBB/IAWM/SWP for taking the place of the ISF (/GR). If the invite was issued by the ESF, they should have passed it on to the ISF. If invites had to be requested, they should have made sure that the ISF, or GR, sent in a request. The SWP (and RBB in particular) is aware of the existence of the ISF, and may even be ISF members. The SWP is very much involved in GR, to put it mildly. So why did the IAWM go?

by E Mon Aug 11, 2003 12:57

Ray, with deep respect to you, maybe because the IAWM as a coalition of groups had helped organise the biggest Irish demonstrations since the tax marches in the late 1970's on February 15th and then could lay claim to represent a significant element of the movement in this country at a European level.

That is not to belittle the Irish Social Forum or GR or whatever just that there had to be some level of Irish representation at the European meeting until a proper mobilising committee was formed here.

It goes without saying to attend the meeting itself and take it from there.

by Ray Mon Aug 11, 2003 13:27

The IAWM did a lot of good work, but they were surfing a wave which has now more or less disappeared. And besides, the marches they organised, and the work they did, was against the war. But the whole anti-neo-liberalism thing that the ESF does? That's what the ISF (and GR) do here, not the IAWM.
What's next, the SP saying they should have had the right to organise it because they have a TD? Sinn Fein because they got so many votes? Maybe Westlife should organise the meeting - they had all those number 1's after all.
The IAWM do one thing, the ISF and GR do another. The thing that the ISF and GR do is the thing that the ESF does, so they were the ones who should have been at the delegate meeting, and they're the ones who should be organising to send an Irish delegation. The IAWM is a single-issue campaign, and its not this issue.

by Badman Mon Aug 11, 2003 14:50

Misquote my arse:

"he was the only person present who could take on this role"

the only person present (among 2 people), well what a misrepresentation, I should be smacked.

It's not a misquote, it's a partial quote, you muppet. And the end of it was left out because it's irrelevant. The point is that the single delegate from Ireland was chosen before the meeting ever took place. Of course if you have a secret meeting with 2 people to choose the delegate, your not going to have a list of candidates that is too long.

This STINKS. The SWP is tearing apart the anti-cap movement again with their ham-fisted glove-puppetery. Do yez think we are all morons??

by Anonymous Mon Aug 11, 2003 15:12

.

by Aoife Ni Fhearghail - Irish Anti-War Movement Wed Aug 13, 2003 18:56 info at irishantiwar dot org d6w 087 7955013

The IAWM sent a representative to the ESF organising meeting because some time ago, (before Florence) we agreed to back the idea of a European Social Forum and decided that those of us who went to Florence should argue for opposition to war & a militarised Europe to be placed at the centre of the ESF.

Those who were at Florence will remember that there was opposition from some single issue groups to making opposition to war central to the ESF. However, anti-war activists from across Europe successfully argued for a global day of action against the war on February 15th.

Earlier this year, the IAWM agreed to send a large delegation to the Paris St Denis ESF and to send at least 1 delegate from our organisation to the organising meeting in Genoa again to ensure that opposition to war remains central to the ESF.

As far as I am aware invitations to attend this meeting were neither requested nor offered, genuine representatives from civil society were welcome to attend from any organisation.

The IAWM will also be campaigning around Ireland's EU Presidency next year and has already agreed to back events organised around the Inter Governmental Conference. And we will be sending at least 1 delegate to the Cairo Summit against US Aggression.

Richard's extensive report of the Genoa meeting explains how civil society organisations can host worskshops etc in Paris and the deadlines for seminar & plenary suggestions. Groups who for whatever reason could not go or chose not to go to Genoa should find it helpful. It is available at www.irishantiwar.org

I hope this clarifies matters.

Aoife

by Badman Thu Aug 14, 2003 11:20

The ESF is the baby bolsheviks' toy international. You get to make stirring speeches, wrapped up in lashings of procedure and formality. Careful that you don't burst with your own self-importance. It reminds me of those student UNs that the nerds used to get involved in in school. All bluster and self importance, full of important sounding titles and earth shattering motions, but really no more important than a bunch of toddlers dressing up as kings and queens. Can I nominate RBB for 'provisional convener of the unified interim coordination of Irish civil society'.

The lack of democracy and accountability is so incredible, I mean Fianna Fail would blush at these antics.

I advise everybody to give this farce a wide berth. The SWP will break your heart again and again, there is no chance of anything progressive coming out of this toy bolshevik council. Ignore them, don't feed the flames of their fantasies of self-importance, they will go away.

by Yeah right, Aoife Sat Aug 16, 2003 12:14

Rich Boy Barrett's daddy pays for the expenses and Richard has plenty of time to travel round the world pretending to represent the Irish anti war movement.
RBB goes to Floernce and claims he is the Irish version of Che Guevara.
He's got the masses behind him, you understand.
But little Stalin Kieran Allen can't afford to travel all year round because he's got to earn his wage lecturing at UCD, so now he is jealous of RBB.

by CPGBfriend Mon Aug 18, 2003 17:18

Check out the articles in the Weekly Worker
http://www.cpgb.org.uk/worker/491/esf.html

Jeremy Dewar from Workers Power argued that the mobilising committee needed to encourage the setting up of local social forums. Given WP?s recent walkout from the Socialist Alliance, it appears that social forums are now the answer. However, he did have a point when he said that moves to set up forums had been blocked by the Socialist Workers Party. The SWP has always seen Globalise Resistance as the 'British section of the ESF' and has actively tried to discourage an alternative. Nevertheless, now that forums have begun in Newcastle, Leeds, Manchester and London, the SWP has been forced to get involved.

Its representatives, Chris Nineham and Alex Callinicos (speaking for GR, of course), were at pains to stress that they were not against the establishment of local social forums. At the same time they did not want to discuss how they could be encouraged. It is clear that they want to retain as much control as possible over the process in Britain and resent any intrusions on their turf.