Cindy Sheehan Takes Protest Against Iraq War To DAIL

by Sionnach Tue Dec 13, 2005 13:48

Leave the protesting and the struggle with us - the REAL resistance to America.
She reared her son to love America join the Army and commit war crimes.
It is only cause he died that she started shedding crocodile tears for the Iraqis and she began criticising her own sick evil imperialist homeland.
If Casey Sheehan were still alive she would still be pro-war.

Just like in the 1960's spoilt college kids and rich middle class squareheads filled the ranks of the anti-war movement - only because their sons were dying in Vietnam- not because the "gooks" were geting napalmed.
As soon as the US military pulled out in 1973 the anti-war movement evaporated.
Those same "hippy" college kids became the white collar lawyers and office executives and their yuppy kids voted for Carter, Reagan, Bush, Clinton and Dubya.
When America pulls out of Iraq they will again go back to their air polluting SUV's and their fast food orgies while Hillary or McCain or George Clooney or whoever buys their way into the White House fights a war against someone else.
Maybe the EU is next -maybe they might send some cruise missiles against us here in Ireland for opposing the Iraq War.
Where will Cindy be then?
Oh im sorry her only son died in Iraq.
She probably never even knew where it was to begin with or cared when America gave Saddam chemical weapons to gas to the Kurds.

The American administration is the enemy but soo too is the fat greedy grasping American public who elect them people like Cindy (she's really a Democrat puppet after all)
I will praise the day someone bombs them into the stone age.

by Josh Tue Dec 13, 2005 14:13

Does the political world realize just how big a hawk Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) really is?
Lost in the coverage of the former Vietnam prisoner of war’s campaign against torture and inhumane treatment of detainees in the war on terror is a true appreciation of McCain’s full-tilt, nothing-less-than-victory support of the genocidal war in Iraq.

McCain was interviewed recently for a story in The New Republic magazine, and he spoke about the war in a way that was both tougher and more rightwing than George W. Bush himself.

"There are a lot of reasons why we should see the fight through to the finish" McCain believes. But perhaps the most pressing reason is also the simplest. “We cannot afford to lose. Just read Zarqawi. We lose it, and they’re coming after us.”
Not only is he a hawk but he is paranoid.

The wisdom of Get-out-fast proposals like the one from Rep. John Murtha (D-Pa.) baffle McCain. The idea of removing U.S. troops from Iraq, only to station them nearby, seems pointless to macho McCain . “To do what?” McCain asks. “I know of no military strategist who would tell you that that kind of arrangement would work.”
Bet he wishes he was in Die Hard so something?

McCain was asked about Murtha himself. “Jack’s a lovable guy,” McCain told me. “But he’s never been a big thinker; he’s an appropriator.”

But why has Murtha decided to come forward now? “As we get older, we get more sentimental,” McCain says, “and Jack has been very, very affected by the funerals and the families. But you cannot let that affect the way you decide policy.”
That’s a statement George W. Bush simply could not make - it just goes to show how Far Right McCain really is.

It could only come from a deranged Vietnam veteran like McCain who both knows the cost of war and who — after little thought — has made the decision that it’s worth paying.

McCain isn’t reluctant to point out American mistakes in Iraq. But when he does, he doesn’t put it all on Bush. Listen to him talk about those missteps and he says “we,” not “he.”

“We never should have said ‘Mission Accomplished,’” McCain told me. “We never should have said ‘a few dead-enders.’ We never should have said ‘last throes.’ Part of it is our own making, by creating expectations which obviously didn’t come to fruition.”

And the president should still, in McCain’s view, get rid of Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld.

But in spite of all that, McCain believes that "the U.S., and the cause of Iraqi independence, are moving forward in Iraq, a little bit at a time".

“I think the situation on the ground is going to improve,” he says. “I do think that progress is being made in a lot of Iraq. Overall, I think a year from now, we will have made a fair amount of progress if we stay the course. If I thought we weren’t making progress, I’d be despondent.”

What has been difficult for McCain — and many other administration supporters — to figure out is why the Bush administration hasn’t been more aggressive and more vocal in its defense of the war. For months, the president has made occasional statements on the subject while Democrats kept up a daily barrage of “Bush lied and people died.”

A lot of charges went unanswered for a long time. Why? “I’ve tried to figure it out. I don’t know the answer, and I don’t want to be critical. But it seems to me it’s pretty obvious there were distractions. There’s a little bit of fatigue that hits every administration in the second term.” Never admits the Iraq War was a disaster of course!

And then: “Maybe there wasn’t an appreciation for the ferocity of the Democrats. I’ve never seen such ferocity, such bitterness and anger. It’s just phenomenal.”
He obviously doesn't like democracy.

And it’s likely to get uglier, because the opposition party sees a political advantage in continuing the fight. “You and I know the Democrats would not be nearly as active as they are if they weren’t looking at polling data,” McCain says. Better look at the polls again John.

Right now, beside the president himself, there is no other Republican in Washington who speaks about the war as passionately and with such determination as McCain. And that makes him — again after the president himself — arguably the most important hawk in the country.

Just look at the uproar caused by Murtha. The press immediately portrayed Murtha as a leading hawk on the war (even though he had already expressed great doubts about the fight) and suggested that Murtha’s announcement meant that hard-core supporters of the war were changing their minds on Iraq.

Now imagine if John McCain were to do something similar. A McCain turn against the war would have an immediate, explosive and enormously damaging effect on the public’s — and the government’s — resolve to keep going.

Not gonna happen, says McCain: “It will be a cold day in Gila Bend, my friend.”

He sounds like he believes it. And by the way, the average summer temperature in Gila Bend, Arizona, is 109 degrees.

by pat c Tue Dec 13, 2005 14:18

i saw her arriving at the Dail while i was at the BODY protest. she was met by david norris.

by Anon Tue Dec 13, 2005 15:27

Be fair - Americans are some of the most propagandised people in the world. Cindy is on a journey, and I think we should help her.

by Sionnach Tue Dec 13, 2005 16:03

Why does she have to come here for?
Is Ireland merely a prop for internal American political disagreements?
That's what this is all about - a cat fight between Dems and Reps - If it were not the Iraq War it would be something else.

The international resistance to the Iraq War can do fine without a dumb American who belatedly realised how evil her country is.

She's only crying for her son who went to Iraq to commit war crimes got killed by the Iraqi resistance to occupation.

The rest of us are at the coal face of resistance to the American hyperpower

by Michael R. Tue Dec 13, 2005 16:04

Support for Cindy is vital. She is a worldwide figurehead in the attempt to stop the US/UK government's drive on war & death.

Anyone who is opposed to this war should make every effort to get to the public meeting tonight at 8pm. As individuals we cannot do an awful lot to stop this bloody war & the might of America. But she can. We need to show her our support as much as possible.

by anon Tue Dec 13, 2005 20:48

cindy supports the democrats in the united states. the democrats are as much a rotten war party. i doubt the swp will say this to cindy. i also note that the swp excluded joe higgins, the most prominant anti-establishment and anti-war TD. is the love-bombing of the socialist party over? no more attempt at 'socialist bloc'? or is it that joe's working class socialism will show up liberal middle class politics of the swp?

by Former conscript Wed Dec 14, 2005 12:14

To Sionnach - Just exactly how are you at the coalface of resistance to the American hyperpower???

by Response Wed Dec 14, 2005 12:50

Cindy denounced the Democrats as pro-war at he public meeting.

by Justin Morahan - Peace People Wed Dec 14, 2005 13:20

Last night Cindy Sheehan told us that she comes from a pacifist family and was horrified when her son joined the military. She was never pro-war.
You should withdraw your untrue comment above that

"She reared her son to love America join the Army and commit war crimes. It is only cause he died that she started shedding crocodile tears for the Iraqis and she began criticising her own sick evil imperialist homeland.
If Casey Sheehan were still alive she would still be pro-war."

Where did you get this misinformation, Sionnach, and why did you publish such acid, untruthful and very hurtful criticism without checking the facts. You owe her a big apology.

by Sionnach Wed Dec 14, 2005 14:00

Cindy's political consciousness was only aroused when her son died in Iraq.
As I said before left wing political activism becomes mainstream in American society only due to selfish reasons - only when thousands of Americans die and their wars are not going the way they expected do the middle class Americans like Cindy jump on the bandwagon usurping the true torchbearers.

At the coalface of opposition to the American hyperpower, activists like me have been opposed not just to American imperialism in Iraq because our relatives died there but to all American imperialism such as Reagan's destruction of the the Communist system. the only system that promised total equality between all citizens of the world, Bush Senior "liberation" of Kuwaiti oil which as the rightful property of the people of the Middle East, Clinton's interference in Irish politics and castration of our armed revolution against British occupation or the unmandated bombing of Serbia in total disregard for international law and the authority of the UN.

The bombing of Pearl Harbour was pivotal for the rise of American imperialism - the American people having defeated Nazism put on its clothing and continued the conquest of the world begun by Adolf Hitler, the real spiritual inspiration for American foreign policy since 1945.

Cindy Sheehan deserves no more sympathy than the mother of an SS soldier and about as much interest.

by Former conscript Wed Dec 14, 2005 14:27

Ah, I see which particular coalface you are at then.

Sorry mate, I'd better get back down pit.

by Pit Wed Dec 14, 2005 14:39

www.witnesstorture.org

by Pit Wed Dec 14, 2005 14:41

http://melbourne.indymedia.org/news/2005/12/101603.php

by Former conscript Wed Dec 14, 2005 15:46

Laudable stuff Comrades.

Can't help wondering about how this is going to play out in achieving any real results though?

Despite actions at Shannon for example, we still had a workforce that has helped 250,000 US troops plus God knows how many rendition flights through the West of Ireland.

Creation of class consciousness is the most effective weapon against capitalist war. Until people start linking their daily lives with the world stage, nothing is going to stop Bushco running the unfortunate of the world ever more ragged.

No matter how well intentioned.

by redjade Wed Dec 14, 2005 15:57

'Creation of class consciousness is the most effective weapon against capitalist war.'

Ummm I think the Shannon Workers may already have 'class consciousness' - as in, they wish to keep their jobs.

'Moral consciousness' (and perhaps legal and constitutional consciousness) is a key issue in regards to Rendition Planes and Troop Carriers and who knows what else the USA is funneling through Shannon these days.

by Former conscript Wed Dec 14, 2005 16:49

Not at all.

by Pit Wed Dec 14, 2005 17:10

The keyboard and anti-war propaganda (for the want of a better word) only has relevance in the context of action in the real world.

Support the anti-war resistance wherever it comes from. How much solidarity has been offered to those who took nonviolent anti-war direct action against Irish complicity in this war? It has been minimal from those opposed to the war in Ireland, how do you hope that anyone else will put their neck out to take the game to them.

Whether its workers, youth culture or people of faith there's a lot of trade union, movement & church bureaucrats running intereference to make sure no direct action takes place against Irish complicity. Looks like all that is being proposed is a biannual marcharound the block.

Cindy Sheehan and the families of military deployed have revived the anti-war movement in the U.S. over this past summer-who would have thunk?

by Former conscript Wed Dec 14, 2005 17:38

... complete agreement with Pit, I'm arguing the long view though.

Obviously reclaiming trade unions, church hierarchy (if that's your thing) is essential in order to forge effective support for those taking action.

Change from below.

Everytime.

We won't win probably next time out.

But we'll get that bit closer.

by noddy Wed Dec 14, 2005 22:21

Its a general rule that the more centralised the society, the more wars their will be. The result of war is also the further centralising of power, which in turn continues until a crisis causes the catastrophic breakdown of the central control, when the cycle starts again.

The first and second world wars were of this type. Since then the nuclear option has upped the anti dramatically the elites of centralised states now realise that starting a war with another nuclear state could lead to ITS immediate destruction (rather than merely that of it's masses whose lives are viewed as expendable).

Hence the trend for wars against the emerging third world (Vietnam, Africa Iraq etc)

A centralised state will not stay centralised for long without a standing army controlled by the rulers. But an army needs wars like a horse needs grass!

Wars are not always planned out as such, but the logic of all wars is pretty constant.

Wars enable elite groups to benefit by;

EXTENDing their power by conquering more subjects

EXTENDing their power by rewarding their supporters through booty and creating profits from a war economy..

EXTEND their power by punishing (and being seen to punish) their enemies to discourage further potential enemies.

Being forced into a war to preserve an already deeply resented unjust social order either by the oppressed themselves or a rival power who exploits their discontent.