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VIDEO - Reclaim The Streets - Police Riots - Street Party

category national | miscellaneous | news report author Tuesday May 07, 2002 11:24author by Irishvidhead Report this post to the editors

POLICE RIOT IN DUBLIN

RECLAIM THE STREETS PARTY DUBLIN 2002 VIDEO POLICE RIOT - VIDEO http://uk.indymedia.org/local/webcast/uploads/policeriot.wmv Gerilla Gardening http://uk.indymedia.org/local/webcast/uploads/ggmaster.wmv
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VIDEO OF ARRESTS
http://uk.indymedia.org/local/webcast/uploads/arrestmasterqn4ss8.wmv

VIDEO OF RTS PARTY
http://uk.indymedia.org/local/webcast/uploads/rtsparty.wmv

3261_2.JPG

3261_3.JPG

3261_4.JPG

3261_5.JPG

author by Joe Sheehanpublication date Tue May 07, 2002 12:13author email jsheehan at subdimension dot comauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

I would like to see the Gardai argue with these images, they were the ones that kicked off the violence. I was there and had a great day and THE ONLY VIOLENCE I saw was started by the Super heavy handedness of the boys and girls in Blue.

I would just like to take this opportunity to thank all involved in the organising and look forward to the next one.

Bigger and better,

Rise UP!!

author by Gary Macpublication date Tue May 07, 2002 12:34author address author phone Report this post to the editors

According to the age old proverb 'the camera never lies' and I couldn't agree more. Striking images of our guardians of the peace.

What scares me most about this is the reports that Garda were not wearing their ID numbers on their shoulders. Surely this is breaking the law?

Well done to everyone involved.

Yours etc. G Mac

author by Patrick Kpublication date Tue May 07, 2002 13:31author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Why be surprised at the heavy handed cop behaviour.? - thats what the straight world does, what it's lickspittles and paid cops do, it's a confirmation of the "theory" of many of the protestors.
Again - the demands of most there are the "impossible" and cannot be met by the current system - if future protests were met with complete police indifference, the nearest McDonalds/Theme Bar/Capitlaist cipher would be attacked to up the ante.
On one level this would mean being free to oppose consumer capitalism which is great but it would also be an unconcious desire for globalisation to engage and taunt it's "other"....
Don't get me wrong - I support the protest.
It's just funny to think that people who actually swear to be totally against the current political system actually moan about the cops not being civic and offering to get cats out of trees etc , moan about a lack of fair play when they get bashed. Do these people actually beileve in what they are saying....which is I might add, the complete overhaul of existing structures and the utter opposition of the state, cops etc..
Ask ur average protestor in a country where you are shot or tortured for your beliefs whether or not they expect to utterly oppose everything the cops stand for and want to remove them and then expect them not to attack you for your beliefs..

If they care that much - fight the pig cunts and stop expecting them to hand out cups of tea.

author by posterpublication date Tue May 07, 2002 14:11author address author phone Report this post to the editors

never thought about it like that before - you make a good point. In future - no peace for the police because let's face it there already is No JUSTICE.

author by Concerned - Lifepublication date Tue May 07, 2002 14:35author address author phone Report this post to the editors

I've seen rioting in seven countries around the globe, but all I can ask here is what do you think you're up to? You accomplish nothing by this. You make no progress. You belittle your cause.

Shame on you.

author by dtpublication date Tue May 07, 2002 15:04author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Pat k is right. protestors seem to be expecting this tolerance and understanding from the pigs that would , if it existed, make obsolete any real need for protests. so what's the answer? prepare for a battle next time? fight em on the streets? dunno , but the protests must keep coming, thick and fast, one good thing to come from this is the resurrection of the virtually unreported Burlington fiasco, lets hope RTE get some of those pics of the numberless thugs with the nightsticks. well done to all who turned out.

Also the other side of things was visible in Bushy on saturday, no batons, no bullshit and everyone helped clean up afterwards.

Saturady a victory. Monday a mess and probably an inevitable one, sadly.

author by The Guvnapublication date Tue May 07, 2002 15:14author email theguvna_2000 at yahoo dot co dot ukauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

Quote: "what do you think you're up to? You accomplish nothing by this. You make no progress. You belittle your cause.

Shame on you."

Please, the point here is simple. Regardless of the "cause" or it's ideals & beliefs, the police came along and started beating people with batons without just cause to do so. This was absolutely wrong. The Gardai are a bunch of muppets and I assure you they will regret their actions. This will only add fuel to the next fire. :)

author by Readerpublication date Tue May 07, 2002 15:43author address author phone Report this post to the editors

And when you have your next march, and cause more trouble... you'll receive just as much if not more a response from the gardai. Do you not think you'd be better off, sitting down with the gardai, and working out a solution to this rather than everyone pointing fingers at everyone?

author by kenpublication date Tue May 07, 2002 15:48author address author phone Report this post to the editors

yesterday we witnessed an almighty riot by a bunch of local
scumbags calling themselves "the guardai" and i must say i
was most impressed. football hooligans and violent protestors
everywhere should study the video tape evidence of yesterdays
row in the hope of producing better tactics of total mayhem
(may-day, mayhem get it?)the outstanding antics of the thin
blue line showed how you can have a riot without incuring
any casualties on your own side, something that is unpresidented
in todays riot culture. i would especially like to tribute to one
man inparticular. amidst the usual ugly faces you see among
the police he stood there tall tanned and just too cool to
wear the shoulder numbers that the other squares do. indeed
that tall tanned cunt really excelled at viciousness and his
obvious flare for beating up his favourite victims, small
defenceless girls, with his mighty weapon is something
all us lads can aspire to. tall tanned cunt (or garda TTC
to his mates) is a posterboy for all you lunatics out there.
so well done the guardai its such a shame the minister
has ordered an inquiry into your behaviour.

author by Robert McElroypublication date Tue May 07, 2002 16:29author address author phone Report this post to the editors

1I'd like to remind our friends in the Garda Siochana that the RUC in the north were responsible for BATONING TO DEATH SAMUEL DEVANEY A NATIONALIST IN THE NORTH IN 1968. Do they want to do the same thing to peaceful protesters? If this is their mentality, Mr Ned Broy of the Broay Harriers did a good jobd when he establishbed those buffoons in 1922!

author by mepublication date Tue May 07, 2002 17:16author address author phone Report this post to the editors

gandhiji should be an inspiration to you all. there must have been an instigation into all this mess, not just a bunch of pigs waving sticks after 6 hours of parading was already in progress? why suddenly attack? someone must have provoked.. maybe the car incident? who knows. lame as the entire fiasco was, striking back is only to make things worse. peace out!

author by democracy.iepublication date Tue May 07, 2002 22:00author address author phone Report this post to the editors

It's easy to feel helpless living in the most corrupt country in Europe where "cute hoorism" is still our way of "doing business". Remember though, that the lack of Garda accountability that we saw first hand yesterday has been overseen by a Fianna Fail administration. If you want to diminish that sense of helplessness even by a small degree then vote on May 17th. Fianna Fail aren't interested in a fair and just society. Their actions over the past 5 years have proved that. It's time to "get the bastards out".

author by Anthrax_Anarchistpublication date Tue May 07, 2002 22:14author address author phone Report this post to the editors

It seems that this deranged and deeply damaged cop was not wearing any ID numbers on his uniform.This cop is well known for his threatening and menancing behaviour.He is foul tempered and violent and attempts to torment and terrorize anyone he arrests.(This is not the first time that this cop has displayed his deranged actions). He is stationed at Mountjoy Garda Station and lives in Palmerstown.This cop is a strange and dark person with an unremittingly bleak view of human nature. I know that to be true. He should be brought to task,but obviously will get away with his harrowing and disturbing behaviour.Anyway, the protest had moments of astonishing impact and disturbing power. An unforgettable performance by all involved.The protesters will not be easily dismissed. Anthrax_Anarchist.

author by Anthrax_Anarchistpublication date Tue May 07, 2002 22:26author address author phone Report this post to the editors

I would just like to add that the cop I mentioned in my previous message is the same guy Ken was on about (TTC). You speak the truth Ken. This scum cop was looking more unhinged than ever before.

author by red raiderpublication date Wed May 08, 2002 02:06author address author phone Report this post to the editors

yesterday was sweet until my pineapple went pear...i was there in great mood at o'connel st. etc, but left there to go for pint in pub on fishamble street. we looked out the window to see around 80 or so people leggin it into the corporation buildings. myself and a friend went outside the pub to get closer to see what story was and a garda van stops with a garda yellin out at me to bring pint back in (oh yeah the pint) he gave us maybe half a second to click wot he said, he storms out of the van straight for me (i think its cuz i have ginger hair?? cant prove it though?) anyways...grabs the glass pours it out and throws away the glass and back into the van with him...i get my disposable camera go behind the van take picture of the reg, then to the garda driving, take picture. second i do this another garda comes over to me grabs the camera and gives it to the garda driving...then the officer gives me the most almighty punch or knee to my balls, (right testicle to be exact)!! i go to the ground for few seconds thinking right so the gardai dont want me to pass the ginger onto my children?? i get up and try to confront (eh...for an apology)the garda who just done the damage and am blocked by his brothers. so i'm yellin at the cowardly asshole while he keeps walkin away and then been pushed back by the garda and one of them sayin "get the f'*k away or we'll arrest you" i say "f@*k off, after that asshole havin my camera and that asshole punchin me in the balls" etc. etc. eventually my mate gets me and brings me back away from the evil blue...what i thought was hillarious, as i'm been pulled back, the photographer who was there is surrounded by a few of the gardai and nearly attacked, then into the van!! then i realise how much pain i'm in...sorry prob way too long...besides all that it was great day, did i hear gabba when we were beside the liffey?? saturday was amazin in bushy!!

author by Bobpublication date Wed May 08, 2002 05:10author address author phone Report this post to the editors

What a bunch of moaners, you should be thankful that the Gardaí are as forceful like the other police forces in Europe.
Are we suppossed to believe the the protesters were holding hands, wearing daisy chains, skipping down the street, when all of a sudden the big bad Gardaí started to beat the crap out all those poor innocent kiddies. Already there is report of protesters shounting abuse and spiting at the Gardaí. Don't get me wrong there are some Gardaí which must now be sacked, but this isn't the one sidded story that many on this comment page are trying to show.
Most of those there don't even know what they are supposed to be protesting against, most are just a bunch of kiddies with nothing better to do. I mean "The Guvna" with "add fuel to the next fire" and "Patrick K" with "fight the pig cunts". The organisers are to blame, what a waste of time these protests are, instead of highlighting their views and fears, the violence that occurs during these protests is again what makes the news and not their opinions.
These protests are attracting the same kind of following that dogged English football during in the 80's. It's no coincidence that each of these protests across the world has rioting and voilence (on both sides) associated with each event. I saw a protest in Dublin during the Christmas period, they walked up and down O'Connell St. escorted by 6 Gardaí, made a 15minute speech and then finished. No problems, try learning from it.

Finally, "democracy.ie", why are you kissing Ruairaí Quinn's ass with his "get the bastards out" quote. A fine site I'm sure, but like most others I won't be looking it up

author by i dont have me a jobpublication date Wed May 08, 2002 08:34author address author phone Report this post to the editors

bunch of moaners?...cheek, you obviously are a short tempered fart who lives in your own dictatorship of "i am god" who is stuk up your own arse! i have absolutely no problem with listening to "the other side's story" i personally know a garda or two and i have respect (where due) for some gardai! yes, i was at the party and did see one scumbag who was around 15-16yrs throw a can he was drinking, he turned his back and flung it over his shoulder, he didnt give two hoots if the can hit a garda or a krusty...shit happens! i dont agree with any voilence whatsoever. you see if that bloke there would have got an apology off a garda, (even if he was sarcastic?). gardai can never apologise and admit been guilty of anything, they will assess the crisis and make sure it doesnt happen again! but you wont hear no "i'm sorry" i'm sure mr.whoever, that you come accross as the type of person who would demand an apology for gettin a punch in your thinginmajig's?...god forbid that you ever get a baton over your head or on your shin and you see your blood poor from your head like a waterfall!! i certainly would not want to listen to you "moan"...but, i would cuz i'm a nice bloke and then i'd say get off your arse and make sure it doesnt happen again to another! i remember on the way home from a session goin tru town and stumbling onto the palestine protest at central bank and marchin with them to israeli embassy. it was brilliant. is that the protest you does be on about? i really do hope that you reply and that you are not one of these people who will say their piece and turn your back and not listen to a reply, (like a lot of gardai i've encounterd) please prove me wrong! if not then...so what! and so what if i dont have a job, i'm waiting for the right oppertunity to come along, have a good day! remember its nice to be nice blah! blah!

author by DGpublication date Wed May 08, 2002 09:18author address author phone Report this post to the editors

While I am all for giving credit where credit is due and praising the Garda when they deserve praise the scenes that I saw broadcast on RTE were disgraceful. What sickened me most was the Garda not displaying his number laying into numerous people for what seemed his own pleasure. Only then to be confronted by an RTE camera and journalist about why he wasn't displaying his number. He knew he was caught out but still showed defiance. Are his days as a Garda up? I don't think so, just move him to another station to terrorise different people.

author by Brendan - MyOwnpublication date Wed May 08, 2002 09:55author email brendannmoore at hotmail dot comauthor address Kerryauthor phone 0879137394Report this post to the editors

In light of the fiasco on Monday, It would seem that a great deal of exitement and apprehension seems to be emerging based entirely around the notion that the somewhat leftie population of Ireland finally get to do something that involves action.

I dont support the anti-globalisation effort, but I respect the idealism involved. It would seem however that because of the Garda action many people will just jump on the band wagon due to the somwhat fashionable nature of the current situation.

Related Link: http://www.geocities.com/antaobhtuathail
author by gubupublication date Wed May 08, 2002 10:53author address author phone Report this post to the editors

I've being waiting a long time to see our streets reclaimed for the ordinary law abiding citizen from the bands of marauding thugs that masquerade as activists. It's alright for them to attack police and property but as soon as someone fights back we are treated to endless whinging and complaining through their own so-called independent media. They then go home to their nice detached houses in South Dublin where Daddy is waiting with sympathy and money. SWEEP THE SUM OFF THE STREETS AND LOCK THEM UP.

author by Fight the power pleasepublication date Wed May 08, 2002 11:14author address author phone Report this post to the editors

well done the guards, nothin like givin' a bunch of hippies a good hammering, piss off back to your shanty towns tree-huggers.

author by Aidan - techno-music.cjb.netpublication date Wed May 08, 2002 12:17author email technomusic at eircom dot netauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

I am sick to death of hearing about the police beating the shite out of people!
A friend of mine was up in court last week being charged with:
Assaulting a police officer
Being drunk and disorderly
And obstructing the course of justice.
"For What?", you might ask. Well, he observed the police chasing a young man down O'Connell St., taking him to the ground and then beating the living shite out of him. He casually questioned "Is that legal?" as he was walking by and next thing he knows, he's on the ground getting beaten about the head by 5 uniformed gardai. He was then brought to Pearse St. Station and assaulted again, repeatedly until his release, on which he had to sign a release which will probably get the Gardai of the hook.
My point is, the Gardai are fucking scumbags in uniforms. I also want to point out that our police force has absolutely no idea of how to control a crowd, as was seen at Monday's protest.

author by Aidan - techno-music.cjb.netpublication date Wed May 08, 2002 12:26author email technomusic at eircom dot netauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

Think what would have happened if our police force carried firearms. How many people would be dead now?

author by 2 liam - nonepublication date Wed May 08, 2002 12:33author address author phone Report this post to the editors

the way i see it ,is that the cops where totally
heavy handed.i was there it was a great day, everybody was dancing, smiling&having a good time.
the insubstantial misdemeanors did not warrant the action the cops took.the cops should be dealt with as anyone who GBHs a person.saying that there was a "small" hard core element, that you will get at any mass gathering.but the cops should have singled the few out and not tarnished everyone with the same brush.our police force need to be answerable.bring on an independent complaints board.nothing is worth the spilling of human blood.

author by stevepublication date Wed May 08, 2002 12:56author email steve at steveryan dot orgauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

it is laughable when the garda spokesperson says the reason they didn't have their garda numbers on their shirts is because "they were in a hurry" to get to dame street.

these guards should go to jail, just like i would if i started battering people about...

author by Philip Dawsonpublication date Wed May 08, 2002 13:35author email philipdawson34 at hotmail dot comauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

After Monday, it is now patently clear that there must be an independent body to investigate complaints against the Gardai. This must be an election issue.

Let us also remember the issues that were at the core of Monday's events:
Globalisation without limits is
1. Not sustainable environmentally
2. Is undermining democracy
3. Is unjust - taking from the poor and giving to the already rich.

author by Oisin - Nonepublication date Wed May 08, 2002 14:25author email oisinhurst at hotmail dot comauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

What the hell is going on? You all worry and hassle of the globalisation of the world/markets and in response you react against the government. Fools. The government is not at the forefront of the globalisation push, the government is not creating Export Processing Zones and creating sweat shop conditions in developing counties (all under the name of globalisation) the government is not creating a global ideal in which we all reach to be one single worldly population.
If you want to blame and protest at the leaders of globalisation go to the core, not protest sadly at the intangible Globalisation ideal, and then alot blame to the government for the process. One simple question, who is pushing the strongest for globalistion? I'll give you a hint, it's not a government.

If you're going to protest, do so at companies like GAP, A Wear, McDonalds, Tommy Hilfiger Sony and Calvin Klein. They are the creators of the globalisation ideal. It's more profitable to sell to one general market than many cuturally different markets, it's more profitable to simplfy the production process and factory location in a globalised world. One world, one market, one product.

You can protest to the government, but you're wasting your time. You're being sold the globalisation ideal in every Levi's ad and every Nike football. You want to make a difference and effect these companies then stop buying their shit. Multi-national corporations have more world wide power then any government, they account for more jobs and more money. It's a brave new world and you are all missing it protesting at a tiger with no teeth.

Shame on the police for their actions
Shame on you for your lack of vision.

author by fredpublication date Wed May 08, 2002 15:03author address author phone Report this post to the editors

this fine upstanding garda, with the fake tan and the psychotic eyes got his pleasure on monday by repeatedly bashing innocent protestors who were shouting "peaceful Protest", unfortunately the gards must have being wearing ear-plugs, which would explain why thy tought we were all shouting "please come and bash us..."

I hope that ignorant, uninformed, blinkered guy "Get a life(+ a job)by Bob" meets this asshole one night in a dark alley and gets a first hand taste of this gards even handedness and lets just see if he still thinks "we should be thankful that the Gardaí are as forceful like the other police forces in Europe"

Anything planned for the june bank holiday?

See you all tomorrow...

author by Martin Power - nonepublication date Wed May 08, 2002 15:34author email nitram4444 at yahoo dot comauthor address n/aauthor phone n/aReport this post to the editors

In disgust at the events of last Monday a demonstration (peaceful) is being organised outside Mill street Garda station on the 9th of May 2002.

author by vincentpublication date Wed May 08, 2002 19:51author email vincentc at www dot comauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

Do they enforce the law or, are they just above the law?

author by PEACEpublication date Wed May 08, 2002 21:01author address author phone Report this post to the editors

IN RESPONSE TOO:
You are all missing the point.
by Oisin - None Wed, May 8 2002, 1:25pm

Shame on us??

It may not be the goverment who set up the multinationals that are trying to rule & fool the people for their profit, but it is the goverment who 'apparently' represent the good of the people, the same goverment who know and except what goes on.


IN RESPONSE TOO:
Stop moaning (get a job)

you are so shallow something I say could not sink you, so sail on fool.

author by Lisa Qpublication date Wed May 08, 2002 21:37author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Ok, well, I didn't see all of what happenend on Monday, but I was there for a couple of hours; enough to see my friends head get beaten repeatedly with a baton, for no real reason, and a few other incidences that don't really need to be described as most people saw enough themselves.
The front page of the Herald this evening demands that the police release the surrveilance videos that are dotted around Dublin's streets, and I for one think that this is one action that should be ordered. If there's nothing to hide on these videos where's the problem in releasing them for everyone to see what really happened?
I hope there'll be a fair turn out outside Pearse Street Garda Station tomorrow (Thursday) evening, especially as what the "keepers of the peace and upholders of the law" was totally uncalled for, and seemed to be an un controlled vulgar display of power.
Lisa Q

author by The other Redpublication date Wed May 08, 2002 22:07author email youthelementskerries at hotmail dot comauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

I want to offer a big bravo to all involved in Monday's party who kept the violence on the citizen's side to nil. This Mayday's RTS is unique in that the partiers retained their dignity in the face of injustice - not an easy thing to do when there's a six-foot rugger thug in uniform beating you about the head... and so in response to Patrick K I'd like to say that meeting violence with violence does not set an effective example of what is wrong with the system. If that's how you react then you're not offering an alternative to the "heavy handled cop behaviour" - just more of the same.

Bob I don't know of anyone who saw or was spitting and gubu darling, these WERE ordinary citizens, some of them simply out for a good time and to feel that the city was partly theirs too, not just a big shopping centre. There wasn't any damage done to public property, only some chalk drawings and a load of bubbles (oh and a car that actually belonged to the people jumping on it - it was terrible funny watching 12 Gardai performing the oh-so-worthwhile task of protecting the useless banger for three hours).

Can I just make a point here too about the reason the Gardai gave for the baton charge - something about not allowing the march to disrupt the traffic from moving, drunken old men from staggering out of the pubs, Gardai from minding the banger, etc. etc. Where were they when the Taxi drivers messed up the transport in Dublin for days on end? Or the teachers marches? Why didn't they baton-charge the farmers for causing disruptions? Why is only young students that don't have the right to demonstrate?

Oisin, the path of consumer resistance has unfortunately already proved ineffective. I think issues of basic human right abuses should not be up to the individual to campaign against, it should be backed up by law. We choose people to represent us because we can't spend 24/7 trying to convince everyone to not buy GAP, that's supposed to be their job.

Aidan saw you on the news last night - well done! The coverage of this event has been phenomenal, mostly due to Indymedia's persistance. The party was fantastic, dancing and talking to complete strangers, and did anyone see the guy on the bike in the leather thong?? Red Raider did you at least get the rest of your pint back? Fair dues if anyone read to the end of this, a wee bit on the longish side, sorry....

author by Kieltspublication date Wed May 08, 2002 23:12author address author phone Report this post to the editors

I dunno if anyone else said this cause I haven't had time to read it, but if u wanna download the movie files then chasnge the file extensions to .mpg insead of .wav as they are dead linx ;)

And I have to say,

You are all missing the point.
by Oisin - None Wed, May 8 2002, 1:25pm
oisinhurst@hotmail.com

this guy is obviously a socialist, so not only is he trying to rationalise the Guardai abusing some of his own, but then strays completely off the point and lays the blame at the door of multinationals. I suppose it is every capitalist in the worlds fault, cause if there was no capitalism, there would have been no protest, then the guardai wouldn't have beatien the living s h i t e (excuse mon francais) out of the protesters! Grow up, there is no excusing this thuggish behaviour.

author by Redrumpublication date Wed May 08, 2002 23:32author address author phone Report this post to the editors

The name of the really big fucker in the shirt seen wading-in left, right and centre is Donal Corcoran (24) based in Mountjoy Station. Cretins like that shouldn't be in the police force of this or any other country, but it helps if ypur father is already a member of the force (Sgt. Dennis Corcoran based in Pearse St). Spoke to a Garda mate of mine (they're not all 'pigs' you narrow-minded gobshites) and he said he would've levelled the bastard himself had he been there.

author by Matthew - Socialist Alternativepublication date Thu May 09, 2002 01:06author email Flossy1 at nme dot comauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

Huge solidarity huggs to our Irish comrades who participated in Reclaim the Streets.
We had similar problems with Police at our recent M1 May day protest here in Sydney when we blockaded ACM-Weikenhut (the corporation that runs the racist detention centres in Australia where refugees and Assylum Seekers are held in appalling conditions for years on end).

Essentially it comes down to Marx's theory of the state and the role of Police in that state.

Never give up the fight, and stay fabulous!

author by John Hamilton - Citizenpublication date Thu May 09, 2002 01:43author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Maybe these protesters are somewhat lucky. They have witnesses and film footage about what happened on Monday. What about the victims of Gardai violence like me who had no witnesses. Long live the freedom to protest. we don't want a Nazi or Stalinist regime in Ireland. Some people would!!!

author by Kevpublication date Thu May 09, 2002 09:16author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Get the videos working. People can't access them and an opportunity is being lost

Related Link: http://uk.indymedia.org/local/webcast/uploads/arrestmasterqn4ss8.wmv
author by bippublication date Thu May 09, 2002 11:57author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Give them a break. The boys in blue put their ass on the line for us 24 7 unarmed. Dublin is no paradise, they work hard. We cant tarnish the whole force with the one brush there is bad apple's in every group. I wasn't at the demo but im sure that all the protesters weren't angles either....... stop playing victims.

author by Shanepublication date Thu May 09, 2002 15:04author address author phone Report this post to the editors


For god sake anyone turning up to that on monday should have known what was going to happen and should have prepared accordingly.

The cops were always going to go spare, that's what they joined the force to do. Behind every garda is the irritating little fucker that no-one in the village (parents included) liked and who decided to satisfy their will to power through enrolment in the force.

They didn't deserve and couldn't earn respect and power to they took the shortcut and joined an organisation where it is conferred upon them.

This isn't a pseudo-racist "thick-culchie" rant, it's about knowing who your enemy is.

Anyone emotionally insecure enough to join the Guards gets an erection at the sight of himself in uniform and has been waiting decades to kick fuck out of the middle class cunts that look down on them as necessary evils that they wouldn't want their daughters marrying.

Next time, have some sense and bring a helmet

author by Taryn 'Taz' Donnellypublication date Thu May 09, 2002 16:04author email donnelt at tcd dot ieauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

Reading through the articles and comments here I'm gettimg horrified by the absoloute muppetry. There are people out there who are going on like the people deserved to be battoned and beaten.By what rationale do you say that. I, like many others, am an innocent victim of the stupidity and pent up anger of an inept, impotent civil power. I also am the FCA corporal who has been mentioned. (Just to clarify I'm not speaking as a member of the FCA/RDF but thats who I am.) I walked out of a pub where I was having a pint with friends for my birthday. I went outside to see what was going on and got jobbed. With the initial guard walking up to me calling me fat then punching me. To that guard I say I'm not fat I'm just too short for my weight;)
I also say I'm not letting this lie. And I say to anyone else complain, sue do whatever it takes. They had no right to do what they did and they should be made pay for it. No internal investigation that just leads to a cover up and guards getting told not to do it again. Criminal prosecution. If that guard was out of uniform, ie. withoun a hat or numbers, then he or she has no more authority than a civilian.(and before someone says it plain clothes have different rules). but dont let them away with this.

author by Paulpublication date Thu May 09, 2002 16:09author email mangler at indigo dot ieauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

The only bad thing about all this is that most of the young protesting are hypocrites because in another few years they will end up working and running these corporations that they protest against and all will be forgotten, It always happens as far back as the 50's its been happening, they all get sucked in and its all forgotten about, its all a big conveyor belt ya see

author by Denisepublication date Thu May 09, 2002 17:02author address author phone Report this post to the editors

I myself was there on Monday, joining in on the cool celebrations,-bongoing,dancing,singing,the craic was mighty and the atmosphere electric, everyone- man,woman,child,dog :)was on a buzz.
Without a doubt the majority of the crowd was peaceful and enjoying the day,NO aggrevation,NO conflict with police,only a handful of winos sent away.
I left at six so I wasn't there when the riots started..with conficting reports its hard to know what to believe.But the people I know up there who were caught in the middle of it sure as hell didn't put a foot wrong man. Totally unprovoked attack from the gardai, and in this day in age this IS SIMPLY NOT ACCEPTABLE.
Its hard to point fingers I know,and we certainly don't need even more tension and bad relations with gardai. But the facts are the facts.
Even if a few individuals provoked the gardai, even if the gardai were worried about the trashed car,they had no right whatsoever to lash out on the other innocent people present, with such brutality and violence.10 people hospitalsed, 9 innocent demonstraters? Why not simply arrest the specific trouble makers in question ?
Serious questions have to be answered,those gardai need to be punished now,justice needs to be carried out now,this is just completely NOT ON. SHAME ON YOU, THE POLICE FOR HANDLING THE SITUATION AS YOU DID, REMEMBER - THE CAMERAS NEVER LIE :)

author by Zoepublication date Thu May 09, 2002 17:38author email Littlelostgoth at hotmail dot comauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

This site was brought to my attention while checking my mail. I have not been in Ireland now for 3 years. I am shocked and appalled by the scenes and accounts of Monday. The only thing that came to mind was that, in Manchester (where I live), the poilce are now being armed slowly in all areas. Starting with the so called "trouble areas". This is because of the racial riots and tensions of this city. I'm glad that the Garda are not armed yet but this will be a perfect excuse for them to say they need arming for protection. Stop them now with this injustice before things get alot worse. How long will it take to heal our scarred country from violence as it is, without adding more.

author by MMpublication date Thu May 09, 2002 22:54author address author phone Report this post to the editors

FIX THE DAMN LINKS FFS

author by Oceanpublication date Fri May 10, 2002 00:43author email thefridgedoo at hotmail dot comauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors


anyone who thinks that any gardaí will be held responsible for their violent thugery is delusional.

anyone who thinks that voting changes anything is deeply delusional, though you may continue participating in your meaningless games if it keeps you amused.

people were having fun and the fucking cops decided to hospitalise as many of them as they could manage...people are not ok with this and for good reason.

there have been alegations that people in the crowd were drinking, so what? drinking is a culturally acceptable pastime and with the absence of violent behaviour this could not possibly legitamise the gardas violent response to the protest.

it is also true that we blocked the road...but since this was the point of the exercise i hardly consider this either a fault or an act of treason necessitating the unofficial declaration of martial law with cops using battons on peaceful citizens and military police jeeps circling the city centre.

to the allegation that we annoyed the average cunt-in-their-car i respond thus:

*we may have delayed you but we didn't put any of you in hospital like the people who were assaulted by the cops.

*we may have delayed you but we don't poison the air you breathe.

*we may have delayed you but we don't run hundreds of you over every year

*we may have delayed you but we don't support the fascist regimes in every country from burma through israel to indonesia that are perpetuated because of the oil you burn.

*we may have delayed you but you were only going home to rot your brain in front of your widescreen TV and we had something more productive to do.

the state and capitalism are the same thing: minority power which is wielded against the majority.

consumer activism is ridiculous. it argues that the problem with capitalism is that people don't buy the right things. bollox. that argument is the same as selling food to people who want to lose weight, fighting for peace or fucking for virginity.

today we have the moral high ground but all the publicity surrounding this event is useless unless a wider understanding of what we were protesting about is realised in the public (un)consciousness. fat chance. RTE continues to refer to RTS as an anti-globalisation protest...which it simply isn't (though many people there held anti-globalisation opinions).

the car is an enemy. the cops are fellow humans beings whose job places them in opposition to those who seek a more humane world. revolution is a battle fought in peoples minds, the streets are were the first awake congregate and there is going to be trouble while the rest of the country still slumbers.

monday was indeed a peacful protest but it must have been a threat of some form to the status quo for it to attract such violent attention from the guardians of the inequality.

i had a great day (but then i didn't get hit). lets do it all again at the end of the summer.

Ocean

author by Sephpublication date Fri May 10, 2002 00:47author email garybettsa at yahoo dot comauthor address Dublinauthor phone Report this post to the editors

Having hearing the new about Gardai removes there badges so they could be the living crap out of innocent people I was not surprised at all,people would want to open there eyes and realize how corrupt the gardau actually are.Me myself have been beaten by the gardai for no reason an d this happens on a daily basis all over the street of Dublin sumthing needs to be done

author by Fiachra - Nonepublication date Fri May 10, 2002 13:47author email fiachra.n.lennon at marsh dot comauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

Fix the frickin links!!!!!

author by Punchbearpublication date Fri May 10, 2002 13:48author email punchbear at hotmail dot comauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

I'd like to see that footage. Is there an alternative url?

author by Fitz - Rational Human Being Societypublication date Fri May 10, 2002 14:37author address author phone Report this post to the editors

First off - it appears that the Gardaí were way over the top in their actions in Dublin and should be held accountable and be taken to task.

Ok so we have a large upsurge in the popularity of the right across Europe and the US... whether we like it or not the far-left are being, in the main, portrayed in the media as mindless anarchist thugs hell bent on simply rioting for the sake of it and being purely focused on the destruction and obstruction of civil order/property.

I believe most protests allied in principle to RTS and the AG 'movement' should focus, for a while at least, more on how they are perceived and the bad apples within that spoil it for everyone.

It is people like the very ill-advised 'Ocean' above that will really not progress any rational evolution of the ideas, philosophies, thoughts etc that RTS and the AG movement ponder and preach. I really fear for our human future when the embodiment of all the ills in the world is personified by the automobile... what next? Knives, Spoons, Lawnmowers, Boats, Food Processers, Computers... If the automobile truly is the embodiment of evil and people who drive them are 'cunts' why are cars not being sytematically destroyed & obstructed on a daily basis? By Ocean and ilk. It is also strange that for a person who refers to themselves as a citizen & who has obviously chucked their lot in with this seemingly luddite collective (a mass display of opinion) does not believe voting (a mass display of opinion) is a viable vehicle for any kind of social change.

I digress slightly... but to get back on track I believe that we all have a duty to promote a more practical and tangible vision of our ideas especially in light of the rise of the far-right in a political sense. It is political apathy, while not thoroughly unwarranted, that has had a large part to play. And apathy is more of a scourge to your average human being than a car IMHO.

Personally, if I had to pick an evil machine manufactured by capitalist-tainted hands to rise up against I'd go for a gun or a missile myself. I'd even drive there in my car to protest.

author by Mollypublication date Fri May 10, 2002 15:35author address author phone Report this post to the editors

I think all you narrow-minded people who are slating the guardai without even considering the other side
are living in la la land, no offence.

Yeah, the tall angry fella kickin' the shit out of everyone is no more than a mere thug and he shouldn't
have been given that kind of power in the first place.

However, that does not mean that every guard in the force is like that. Like someone else mentioned, they
put their neck on the line 24/7 for us and deal with all the crap that goes on that you don't even want to hear about.
Personally, I think they do a great job and it's
just the seedy few, powerhungry ones with attitude problems that have the problem and need to be weaned out!

Think of how many of them are killed in the line of duty, it's more than you'd think.
Because they put their necks on the line protecting us! I think we need to applaud the guardai. Would you be that brave?

And Oisin, you haven't a clue, although you make some mildly accurate statements..you just blame it on every company that actually does well...that's business,
that's life...it's not a fuzzy little world you're living in! Grow up! I find it hard to believe you've never had
a McDonalds and that you run around naked, wear no brand names and are completely innocent! Do you want to turn Ireland
into a nation of eco-warriors...you're probably just a spoilt brat with nothing else to spend daddy's money on....

author by steve k - steve against capitalismpublication date Fri May 10, 2002 21:45author email bouldbowsie at hotmail dot comauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

the footage is quite striking. there seems to be an inordinate number of gardai enjoying their actions of beating unarmed and obviously passive protesters.

the question i want to ask is what did the gardai have to gain from attacking the socialist protesters? the question i find is nothing. what seems to have happened is that the gardai, under poor leadership on the ground, had no specific plan to deal with the protesters and in the confusion a few of them 'lost the head'. this is unacceptable and these gardai need to be severly repremanded. if it is true that some gardai removed their numbers then they must face criminal prosecution to the fullest extent of the law, an example needs to be made of them.

in general though i believe that our police force is one of the most tolerant in the world. anybody who lives in dublin and attends these protests will tell you that for the most part the police handle protests in a fair and evenhanded manner. one incident shouldnt tarnish the whole forces reputation. although it does depend on pat byrne taking heavy action over the renegade gardai seen in these photos.

on the other hand it is completely understandable for anti-capitalist protestors to feel frustrated. its very hard for them to engage politically as the system in this country and every other western state has made sure the far left is completely dis-enfranchised from the political system. i really hope those of you who passionately believe in your cause and are educated enough to pursue it are successful in every avenue you take to try and topple capitalism. its a pity the movement has to attract so many brats who are displaying their opinions on this forum. there's nothing 'cool' about being a leftie. you're only damaging the cause. go buy a nintendo or something and stop tarnishing our efforts.

author by Concernedpublication date Fri May 10, 2002 23:51author address author phone Report this post to the editors

A Chara,
We can all see what happened by these photos. Hopefully this will show how close linked the R.U.C. and the Garda really are cross border co-operation ??

Slán
Tiofáidh Ár Lá

author by Bobpublication date Sat May 11, 2002 06:28author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Here's your reply "i dont have me a job ".
I too have a friend in the Gardaí, he works in Dublin and some of the shit in his job is unbelievably. Dealing with people who've attempted to attack with syringes and knives, attending murder scenes, and now been branded as a "pig cunt" because of those Gardaí who I've already said should be fired.
My point is that the whole thing is overblown, this was a few Gardaí who showed their true colours and will probaly be showed the door for it. Also those organising this event are doing their best to highlight the police brutality and forgetting why they were there in the first place. I didn't hear or read one interview where their issues were raised, a total waste of time (in my opinion).
Different protest to the Palistine one, but in relation to that, I wouldn't march with them, they'd haven't marched or spoken out against the sucide bombers who are killing innocent Isralais. It doesn't work; we can look North to so that they must be no killing before any peace can be obtained. Both sides can take example from what has been achieved there.
By the way the Gardaí are not meant to appoglise, it leads them open to being sued. Happened to a friend who worked in a hotel, guy slipped on some of his own drink, friend said, "I'm sorry Sir, are you ok", guy sued for £10,000 using my friend’s appoligy and won. They must do it or they'd have ever drunk sueing the State (i.e. us).

author by ceabhaill blainpublication date Sat May 11, 2002 20:19author email cearbhaill at wanadoo dot esauthor address c/primavera2,2c sevilla espanaauthor phone Report this post to the editors

i have a number of friends who work for the police and if you think that they are acting by themselves you are gravely mistaken these police that i have seen are not on their own they are ordered to do this so don't go demonstrating the pictures syaing the bloody police are pigs. you should come over here to spain and try to organize a protest and get out of it with your two legs.(oh and by the way i was present at the glen of the downs protest and some of my friends were there at the so-called protest) you should find a way to eliminate the militant factions which you have incorporated into your peaceful protests. good luck

author by Peter Burns - privatepublication date Sun May 12, 2002 08:20author email petehelen at celticfc502 dot fsnet dot co dot ukauthor address author phone 01228-515151Report this post to the editors

the reason people who belittle your grievence with the police is that they do not see this kind of sickening brutallity in their everyday lives they don't see it on Sky News or on their way to work,all they see is 'freaks'who are causing trouble and forcing the 'police'to smash your brain in because everyone knows that sitting is illegal and causes a threat to public tranquility therefore the police cause a riot and bludgeon people in order to maintain public order.
When you look at the faces of the cops baton in hand what you see is pure hatred at anyone and everyone a seemingly unbelieveable frenzy of violence towards people who have done nothing to warrant it and the person who wrote one of these comments and said 'be thankfull our police aren't as violent as their european counterparts',well thats an assuring thought as the baton lands on your head you can be thankfull that the cunt who has hit you hasn't got a machete in his van because at that point of blind fury he'd use it,whats the betting that prat who wrote that needs a brush with the law on any level and see how he/she are treated.
Ghandi a great man who forced a colonial empire to capitulate by refusing to fight and believed in 'passive resistance',well he was a great man,,one in a million,the trouble is most people myself included have'nt got his willpower or patience to do nothing,next time a pig hits you do what they do,single a couple out and baton them you still won't win but cops getting hit by batons will get on sky news and force the public to realise what people have to do in order to be heard,no one want's to become a freedom fighter they are forced to, by a brutal oppressor.

author by garypublication date Sun May 12, 2002 14:05author email garymadden at dol dot ieauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

protesters shouldn't fight back against the Gardai, 'cause that will justify their thugery to the mostly ignorant and apothetic public. instead of getting a bad name by lashing out, protesters should practise what they preach, to be just and peaceful. it'll show the rest of the world that we aren't just bored students out for a riot and it'll show our government and Gardai up for the bastards that they really are.

author by John O'Gradypublication date Sun May 12, 2002 15:58author email johnogrady56 at hotmail dot comauthor address 355 Highland Ave. Somerville.MA. 02144. USAauthor phone Report this post to the editors

This is what was seen on the Evening News in Boston via NBC CBS ABC
CNN etc. All I can say is I am very saddened by what I saw. The Police were acting like common Thugs

author by Joe Ordinarypublication date Mon May 13, 2002 09:30author address author phone Report this post to the editors

You have a big protest.
The Gardai are sent out to make sure no one causes any trouble.
You hold up traffic and the normal flow of the city.
Those same Gardai are intrusted to stop the obstruction to the city.
You start making fun of two of their fellow Officers who recently died.
The Gardai don't take it too well.

Well dahhh, I've never been to a protest that was peaceful. There's always some goon who insists on causing trouble. And while no one anywhere will deny that the right thing to do isn't baton someone to the head, most people will also agree that harassing the Gardai isn't a good idea either.

Get off your high hourse and stop trying to make out like your free of any responsibility for this.

author by jim bloggspublication date Mon May 13, 2002 17:52author address author phone Report this post to the editors

weRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!! dead right!! magic!

author by Bettsypublication date Tue May 14, 2002 00:04author address author phone Report this post to the editors

What the fuck do u know I know what the gardai are like u say there not all the same I agree but theres only 1 or 2 straight gardai in the force an all this bollocks they put there lifes on the line thats a loda me bollocks they love there job cause they have authority an 99% of them are on a power buzz

author by jackintheboxpublication date Wed May 15, 2002 00:27author address author phone Report this post to the editors

It's ignorant to think that people can hate the gards because of a few who where on a power trip.

The gards do put there life on the line everyday to make sure our streets our safe.

Would you like your girlfriend to be raped ,butchered killed whatever could possibly happen if there was no law.
Quite simply that wouldnt work.

To the dickless asshole gards who were so sure what they were doing was right i hope YOU and YOUR whole fucking kind choke on the seargents dick and die you misguided ignorant prick fuckhead cumbucket assholes.

You spend youre time walking around thinking your shit smell's sweeter than mine! THAN MINE!!!!


yOU SHITSMELLING FUKS dont know what you started.
A bunch of fuckin muppets who feed of other peoples pain.

you fuckin moronic pricks think youre great
a lovely shiny baton, a badge, a shiny jacket, a pulse and a bit of authority you think your king of the fuckin world !!!

YOU ASSHOLES ARE GONNA FUCKIN BURN

author by newsoundpublication date Thu May 16, 2002 00:18author address author phone Report this post to the editors

How independent are you indymedia, one side of the story is only shown. I'm in a priviliged position of having seen the ENTIRE footage, (NO EDITING), and I can only say that the actions of few tarnish so many. Such one sided views and footage can only tarnish the good reputations of the media in general.

author by 8denpublication date Thu May 16, 2002 14:10author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Can I ask where you saw all the unedited "raw" footage?

author by Irishvidheadpublication date Fri May 17, 2002 13:08author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Seen all the footage have you?
what did you see?
Footage from how many cameras?
What was in it?
Please share this privaliged information with us
do you still have all that footage, why not post it on indymedia?
IT IS TOTAL CRAP that Indymedia EDITED the footage before giving it to RTE TV3, as they will confirm they themselfs edited from the origional tapes.

author by Mollypublication date Tue May 21, 2002 02:49author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Hmmm, Bettsy. Firstly, you really don't know what you are talking about. It really is a very narrow minded statement to make that all the Guardai are just idiots (although more eloquently than you could manage to put it).

You say that it's rubbish that they put their lives on the line for us every day. Well, anyone with half a clue can clearly see the evidence of this. At every court case that is covered on T.V regarding a criminal prosecution etc., the names of the guardai responsible for seeing justice done are usually displayed and the details of their involvement are also given. This shows us that they are the crucial key to stopping our society plundering into a deplorable situation somewhat similar to the equivalent of the Bronx in the States and countless other examples. In order to stop these levels and extremities of crime as they do so every day they do, indeed, put their lives on the line.

You're probably one of those little scumbags who goes around robbing cars, causing fights and generally causing trouble, degrading our level of society and then wonders why the 'bastards' keep picking on you. Is it any wonder you think they're mostly assholes?

To reiterate finally, I am not saying that every one of them are perfect, there are some bad apples in there but overall, they do a great job.
I don't neccessarily agree with how the Guardai handled the situation in town that day but as someone else mentioned previously, the protestors were hardly dancing around in their daisy chains or whatever and that they didn't provoke the guardai!?

Lastly, Bettsy, you obviously don't know enough about, well, anything you're talking about and haven't come to your decision that all guardai are assholes based on an educated opinion. So my advice to you: Start watching the news, reading the newspapers and listening to the radio. Oh, and next time in your feeble response can you please watch the spelling. Cheers.

author by King Mobpublication date Tue May 21, 2002 13:46author address author phone Report this post to the editors

For someone who's attacking someone's presumtions and perception you do appear to be very narrow minded.

"You're probably one of those scumbags robbing cars and degrading our society".

How do you know? And were do you get off slagging someone and labelling them because of their grammer.

As for this "the protestors were hardly weaving daisy chains"

Actually they were. There was childrens face painting, dancing, juggling and fun.

Yes there we people who were an arrigvating infulence.

But as you say the Gardaí are supposed to be TRAINED to deal with this. The are supposed to handle this and they do put their life on the line, But no Gardaí were injured, and weeks later the justification for the Gardaí response has been non existant. This was not a situation which required the level of brute force applied by the Gardaí the indiscriminate assault of both protestors and passerbys.

I'm tried of this "The Gardaí were provoked" crap. Bollocks they're supposed to recieve training to handle this situation and not to react rashily, and if I injured people in the manner which the Gardaí did, I'm certain "I was provoked" wouldn't be a jusitified legal defense.

author by Mollypublication date Wed May 22, 2002 23:41author address author phone Report this post to the editors

To King Kob. It's hardly narrow-minded for me to presume that Bettsy isn't one of those scumbag types that go around degrading our society. From the way you are ranting, it is possible that also you are an enemy of peace-loving society.

The gardai are trained to deal with unrest, but clearly the trainees didn't envisage a bunch of mad hippies demonstrating against something they don't even understand, getting violent and threatening. To date Irish Gardai are not armed, because it is believed they can control Irish society by peaceful means, unfortunately the idiots demonstrating have introduced a level of violence that Irish society is not prepared for...What did they expect the police to do?

Keep on like this and we'll have the same levels of violence as in some US cities. We'll be more American than the Americans...isn't that what the protesters were demonstrating for? Oh but they probably didn't really have a clue...useless troublemakers.

author by ;'k'publication date Wed May 22, 2002 23:42author address author phone Report this post to the editors

;

author by Despublication date Wed May 22, 2002 23:49author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Molly, Do you have a clue what you are banging on about?

I can't work out what you're saying...

author by Oscarpublication date Thu May 23, 2002 11:35author address author phone Report this post to the editors

How perfect that you wrote grammar with an 'e' on that statement.

author by King Mobpublication date Thu May 23, 2002 13:57author address author phone Report this post to the editors

So basically holding strong convictions makes you an enemy of peaceful society.

Attempting to engage in a peaceful protest makes you a danger to peaceful society, and to protect society, society must use armed thugs to beat you to a pulp, until you quietly start whimpering and conforming.

These were not a bunch of "mad hippys" most of the people I've spoken to who were there have jobs, but also feel strongly and passionately that some fundamental changes need to be made in our society.

Keep on like what Molly? At no point has anyone come forward to say they were assaulted by protestors, nor was any Gardaí injured. I'm unclear how you reached the conclusion that my behaviour or my writing his going to lead to an increase in violence.

One of the best things about this event is it is reminding people of Abberylea and what occured there, when your precious, "trained" Gardaí shot a mentally disturbed man. I haven't the time to go into details, but it is prefectly clear he wasn't a danger to anyone.

Your Gardaí aren't trained to deal with that or the RTS, and the unrependant attitude of Pat Stone appears to tell us that the lesson learned by Gardaí is if you're beating up defenseless teenagers make sure you grab the video camera while you're at it.

And Oscar I'd drop the "E" but the Molly would be freaking about drugged up hippies going on a violence rampage.

author by Mollypublication date Thu May 23, 2002 14:47author address author phone Report this post to the editors

As I've pointed out before O Royal one, I am aware that not every single member of the gardai is immaculate, however it is all too easy to join with the masses when one guard messes up and mouth off about the guards being violent thugs.

In a democratic society, I think it is truly pathetic that so few can think as individuals. It's very easy to jump on the bandwagon, King Kob, and lambaste the peacekeeping forces because the rest of the country's no-brainers are doing so, however you are incapable of really assessing the matter objectively, and I genuinely believe that people with your way of thinking are a threat to a peaceful society.

But go ahead, call the gardai every name under the sun, group them all together as thugs because one or two members overstepped the line...and what will change? Others with no ability to form logical opinions will jump on our bandwagon and society will continue to crumble...

author by King Mobpublication date Thu May 23, 2002 15:25author address author phone Report this post to the editors

I'm not bandwagon jumping, I was there on the day. It wasn't one Gardaí, senior officers were there on the ground, excersing neither constrant or control of their men, and women.

And this is not an isolated incident, I can think of seven separate incidents where Gardaí have for example assaulted people in an attempt to stop them filming Gardaí brutality. This however is the first time something like Indymedia was here, to make you aware of whats actually happening.

How did you draw the opinion that I'm not objective? Whats my way of thinking anyway Molly? care to enlight me on how exactly my thought process works?

If anything you're the one showing a narrow fixed irrational mind. You seem to delight in announcing that large proportions of society, are scum, can't think for themselves, and need to be told what to say and do. Which is fascism, I bet you read "Brave new World" and thought to yourself, "see thats how society should be run."

Essentially thats what you're saying, that theres a group of intelligent people who should watch what they say and do otherwise they'd be a bad infulence to the great unwashed. Which is incredibly bigoted.

author by Mollypublication date Thu May 23, 2002 16:17author address author phone Report this post to the editors

So you in the history of your lifetime can think of an amazing seven times that the gardai behaved out of line!!!

And how many thousands of your precious civilians cause trouble daily?

Why were you at the protest, King Kob? Did you believe by frustrating drivers, "facepainting and wearing daisychains" (and 'tis yourself I quote) you could really make a difference...

I am far from biggotted, simply realistic. Were the people of Germany all so intelligent and freeminded that they were able to resist Nazism in the 1930's? By organising marches, Hitler too managed to whip up a frenzy and convince a whole nation...because unfortunately, though you may like to believe that you live in a world where people can have their own opinions and think independently, this is not the case. Many many human beings are crowd-followers, hence you may often have heard them being referred to as sheep.

And this is the danger, when self-righteous beings like yourself, join the thousands who have already been whipped up into a frenzy and so develops group hate...where people are united in hate against one group or sector in society. The results are always destructive...

And no, I don't pretend to know how to run society(although I have some good ideas about it...my own may I add), however I believe that those who don't have a clue and mouth off anyway because everyone else is are very dangerous...the fool is always more dangerous than the wise man...Brave New World??? Unlike you, I can form my own opinions, and don't need to adopt them from books.

author by King Mobpublication date Thu May 23, 2002 17:57author address author phone Report this post to the editors

**********So you in the history of your lifetime can think of an amazing seven times that the gardai behaved out of line!!!***********

Pay attention Molly and actually read what I said, I said I can think of seven inicidents when Gardaí prevented people from filming with force, when they were filming Gardaí brutality. And all these are in the past 12 monthes. Not seven incidents of police brutality seven incidents when Police were behavingly illegally and tried to stop people from showing this.

As you keep pointing out, these people are supposed to protect and uphold the law, not to break it.

****Why were you at the protest, King Kob? Did you believe by frustrating drivers, "facepainting and wearing daisychains" (and 'tis yourself I quote) you could really make a difference...****

Yes I do. People were informed and politised by what occured, awareness was generated and it's platform from which a lot of good can be done. Plus alot of fun was had. Remember fun Molly? By the sounds of it, you could really do with a good party.

******I am far from biggotted, simply realistic. Were the people of Germany all so intelligent and freeminded that they were able to resist Nazism in the 1930's? By organising marches, Hitler too managed to whip up a frenzy and convince a whole nation...because unfortunately, though you may like to believe that you live in a world where people can have their own opinions and think independently, this is not the case. Many many human beings are crowd-followers, hence you may often have heard them being referred to as sheep.*******

I can't describe how mindless your comments about Nazism are. To compare an anarchic fun street party to the Nuremberg rallies is one of the most idiotic comments you've come out with. You think it's "pathetic" that people can't think as individuals but don't give anyone the chance to do that, by giving them the benefit of the doubt.

*******And this is the danger, when self-righteous beings like yourself, join the thousands who have already been whipped up into a frenzy and so develops group hate...where people are united in hate against one group or sector in society. The results are always destructive...*******

You think we're going to end up in uniforms and herd all cluchie Gardaí into camps. But that is a demented and frankly strange image you're presenting us, that theres a group of thousands ready to sow stars of David onto Gardaí jackets, my only response is Cop on.

As for Your Brave New World, you seem intent on misunderstanding me don't You Molly? I make a reference to it to describe a worldview as a point of reference, people do that. I have plenty of orginal and innovative ideas of what i'd like to see the world become, and am fascinated by what you might think could occur. I'm not some ignoration sheep m'dear I have opinions that you seem uncomfortable with, and think should be silenced. Which is censorship and fascism again.

author by Mollypublication date Fri May 24, 2002 00:12author address author phone Report this post to the editors


Oh King Kob I am so sorry for making such a massive mistake, that being crediting you with an intelligence capable of comprehending my argument.

Oh dearest King Kob I could never be so ignorant as to compare the Nuremberg rallies with that hippy get-together-no, no-you have failed to understand the concept of simile used to illustrate a point about human psychology. I admit from your earlier comments, I should have understood that it is senseless to enter discussions so deep. As I pointed out before, you just see what appears to be the obvious and join the crowds in their mission (whatever it may be, as long as you are one of the gang).

I think it's incredibly sad that you can't realise, despite the omnifarious examples I have offered, that it is fruitless, and indeed dangerous to give the masses the benefit of the doubt.

With regard to your comment on uniforms, I don't suspect for a moment that you would join any force that dons a uniform, simply as there is a psychological test to join the gardai or otherwise, (but of course you would not be aware of this, for you base your argument entirely on one-sided, uninformed opinions, namely you go with what the masses say).

Stars of David...you're the one taking it too far. And all gardai are culchies? That is a highly intelligent, well-thought-out statement!

What are your ideas dearest King Kob? For, to date, you have been completely incomprehensible. Tell me, how would you run the world? I too would be highly fascinated, or at least highly amused.

Do you really have opinions? Ones you formed on your own I mean? Oh please enlighten me!

Baaah Baaaah

author by King Mobpublication date Fri May 24, 2002 12:20author address author phone Report this post to the editors

You had the first say, allow me to have the last?

You mock my references to Brave New World, and then slag off my ability to spot a simile. A simile Molly is a metaphor that uses the words "like" or "As". I've scanned over your dribblings about Nuremburg, and don't see a simile anywhere, just some hysteria

As for my comments about Stars of David and cluchies, I was ripping the piss out of rantings about "where people are unitied in hate againist a group or members of society". I can spot a simile Molly, can you spot satire?

As for the onifarious examples (my Molly what a big word) would you care to reiterate these examples? Because I've re-read your posts and aside from gibbering about scumbags, and Nuremburg (and I'd argue that your attitude of trusting the state and police above people is fascist) you've not given one example of why the human race doesn't deserve the benefit of the doubt.

So I'd hardly call what you wrote a simile. I'd call it an attempt to whip up hysteria againist people's genuine and righteous outrage at the continued abuse of Police and state authority, and y'know if there were a few more protests about that in 1928.......

As for the psychological test to join the Gardaí Molly you say "I don't suspect for a moment that you would join any force that dons a uniform, simply as there is a psychological test to join the gardai or otherwise.... "
Otherwise what Molly? you just trail off. And I'm incomprehenisible? And you're right I wouldn't join any force that expects me to don a nice uniform; oppress people and assault the public who are asserting their democratic right.

I have these things call morals you see. I have morals, convictions and opinions. Also I was so fascinated by your own "brillant" ideas about how society should be run I asked you to expound on them earlier and you failed to do so. I'm dying to see how innovative you are.

Your attitude of consistently refering to me as a sheep would be insulting, were it not for the fact that you consistently bleat out the same tired statements reiterating the same tedious points I've heard elsewhere and better put. It's a little pot calling the kettle....

Oh and thats not a simile either Molly.

author by Mollypublication date Fri May 24, 2002 21:42author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Ditto

author by Bobpublication date Mon May 27, 2002 22:47author address author phone Report this post to the editors

King Mob what kind of a dream world are you living in. How can you describe it as a "fun street party". This wasn't St. Patricks Day parade, come on.
You can't tarnish all the Gardaí with the same brush. There has been plenty of people on this comment page who've said that those Gardaí involved went over the limit and should be punished. But from your side there has been no condemnation of those who attacked and abused the Gardaí, don't deny it as a publican has said that some of those involved in the protest threw beer bottles at the Gardaí.
You've got to realise that if the Gardaí weren't present, there are plenty of people around who love to fight and hurt others(in Cork recently) and if they had attacked the protesters who would they be phoning for help..(i.e. 999).

author by redeyes - The red group of Canadapublication date Tue May 28, 2002 17:48author address somewhere in Canadaauthor phone Report this post to the editors

I say fuck authority
silent majority
raised by the system
now it's time to rise against them
we're sick of your lies
fuck no we won't listen
we're gonna open your eyes

thanks for reading this word from the WISE.

author by Bobpublication date Wed May 29, 2002 05:35author address author phone Report this post to the editors

If I meet you on the street redeyes I'm gonna kick the living shit out of you, and then stick you with a fucking knife, and then I'll move onto your family, I'll start with your mother by first.......oh, wait, no, no I won't, because the "authority" would probably catch me and the "system" would put me away for the rest of my life. So I won't. Do you get it??

Sorry about above but do you get the point?

author by King Bobpublication date Wed May 29, 2002 16:59author address author phone Report this post to the editors

How can I describe it as a street party? It wasn't like St. Patricks Day?

Well it was and it wasn't;

It was in that there were jugglers and street theater, and costumes, and fun, and kids getting their face painted. Y'know a fun relaxed atmosphere?

It wasn't in that there was no big corporate logos, smeared over everything (thae sponsorship that alledgly makes all these things possible, which was absent at this street party)

So yes Bob I can and will describe it as a street party, people brought their kids and everything. I can do this I was there, you weren't and your view of events is skewed by the fact you've spoken with Gardaí and Listened to Joe Duffy to get your reports.

So a publican came forward and said what? If it's the same guy he actually stated he saw broken Glass no one throwing bottles, and gosh broken glass on the streets of Dublin, never seen that before!

Actually I only saw one person injured by a can, and that was a protestor who was struck.

As for defending the poor Gardaí. No Gardaí were injured, none, and twenty plus protestors were hospitalized. No passerby has come forward to claim they were assaulted by protestors, but some have come forward to say they were assaulted by Gardaí; and they blame the Gardaí for what happened not the protestors.

Not only that as for your comments about plenty of people who would have caused trouble if the Gardaí hadn't intervined, the "the Gardaí had to get violent otherwise there would have been trouble" argument, which is bollocks. After the worst of the violence everyone just stood up hands in the air and chanted "peaceful protest". Under the worst provaction I saw no group of protestors attack or fight back, no one used this as justifcation for starting a riot which is what you're alledging.

So no I can't say hand on heart that every protestors behaved civilised and didn't abuse Gardaí; but I'm not going to attack protestor behaviour, because I saw NOTHING that justified the level of brute force and ignorance used by the Gardaí.

author by Bobpublication date Fri May 31, 2002 00:17author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Joe Duffy, Joe fucking Duffy!! Are you trying to fucking insult me!!!!

Just because you didn't see any wrong doing on the protestors behalf doesn't mean that they didn't do anything. If there had been no camera's on the Gardaí it wouldn't have meant that they didn't do anything because it would have just been reported.

You want us to believe your report of events because you were there but dismiss anyone elses (who were also there..i.e. the publican) whose view is different to yours. Come on!

I believe that the truth lies between your report on an innocent "street party" with nobody having done any wrong, and the Gardaí version of correct action been taken.

So while I diagree with you above I'm sure we're both of the opinion that Joe Duffy should be broadcasting on Alaskin Radio to fucking Eskimo's who consider George Bush as intellent!!

author by King Mobpublication date Fri May 31, 2002 13:35author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Yes I am trying to insult you........

"If there had been no camera's on the Gardaí it wouldn't have meant that they didn't do anything because it would have just been reported."

I'm sorry I have clue what you are trying to say here, I got lost in all the double negatives.

The Publican in question spoke on Joe Duffy....

The fact is "Bob" you've been wandering around the site trying to justify Gardaí reaction and response and tut tutting protestors when you've got no evidence to back up your claims.

So Bob if you keep insulting my "intellent", I'll keep insulting you.

author by Bobpublication date Sat Jun 01, 2002 02:24author address author phone Report this post to the editors

King Mob, I didn't say that anyone used this as justifcation for starting a riot. I said that there are people who would have no problem attcking the protesters like they do on the streets late at night, i.e. the example of Cork, and then it's the Gardaí who are called.

You accept the word of those passerbies (as do I) that came forward to say Gardaí assaulted them, but not the word of those who saw wrongdoing on the protestors’ part. You either can't, or just won't accept othere peoples view (who were also there!).

I'm a bit too busy working during the day to listen to Joe Duffy. I read the publicans report in the paper, not on your favourate radio show.

Sorry you got lost in the double negatives, ("So a publican came forward and said what? If it's the same guy he actually stated he saw broken Glass no one throwing bottles, and gosh broken glass on the streets of Dublin, never seen that before!" - because that makes sence) and my mis-spelling of intellegent seems to upset you so much, why not just winge on abit more so you can continue to feel sorry for your self.

I've stated a number of times (try read what I wrote) that those Gardaí involved should be ousted from the force (I haven't justified them). But that's the problem with you; you can't take anyone else's opinion into consideration. Your failure to take others people's word who were there and your failure to condem those who abused the Gardaí who didn't raise a batton, show's that you’re not worth listening to and this site isn't worth revisiting. Pitty, but it was interesting, well done on a good site IMC.

Until the next street protest, sorry, street "pary", sorry King Mob, didn't mean to upset you again. Let the one sided winging continue.

author by King Mobpublication date Tue Jun 04, 2002 01:06author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Bob let me get this clear;

You who have read one article (where?). I must take this as writ, despite, this claim being unsubstaniated (by evidence of Gardaí or anyone coming in with injures sutained from a flung bottle) because we "have to agree." Lets go back, no one has made a complaint againist protestors; and no Gardaí was injured.

Look mate, I don't feel sorry for myself, I feel sorry for you. Sorry that you must twist facts to suit your worldview.

Condemn people who abused innocent Gardaí? What about Gardaí condemning in public their comrades who assaulted members of the public? Those Gardaí should be abused for not coming to the aid of people being attacked, whether the attackers are Gardaí or not. Either with force, or later in words and testimony, but that's not going to happen.

Ousted from the force? Actually I'd rather the outcome of all this to be an independent inquiry body set up to investigate Gardaí; than your feverent hope of a few scapegoats, they'll be sent off and the rest of the Gardaí can continue to act with impunity and disregard; oblivous to these events.

author by Judge Dredd - 26-Counties Guarda Review Commissionpublication date Thu Jun 06, 2002 06:55author address author phone Report this post to the editors

... you arrogant little fucking piece-of-Nazi-filth!!

Let me just caution you here, sunshine, maybe snap your bonehead back to reality, alright?

You were starting to sound suspiciously like your Gestapo mates from up the North just then, my son, like as if your jaw was working faster than your brain again? As if there were no law to check your sadistic impulses? Fancy yourself a bit of a James Bond character, do you?

Well, let me explain to you, matey, that you have planted yourself up to you thick lugs in some unholy shite! Because there are still enough people in Ireland unprepared to stand idly by while self-declared SS-Stormtroopers such as yourself club peaceful protestors to your heart's delight - it won't matter a tuppenny fuck to them if it be SS-RUC or SS-Guardai doing the clubbing and/or killing; the stitches will be the same and so the follow-up, the reaction will also be the same.

You and your chums might think you can skip the rap for this one - but my sincere advice to you is to not even bother trying - admit your lawless behaviour, apologize to your victims personally and then accept the corresponding holiday-on-ice at State's expense, like men.

That would be the honourable course of action. However, well-founded doubts about your sense of honour and democratic responsability hang rather thick in the air these days.

To assist you in recapturing those abandoned senses, let me just remind myself that you don't live in a bubble, my very special young chum, so unless you were thinking of having a drunken plastic-surgeon patch various plates of silicone into your hide before shipping you off to the Moon, consider that doing the time and letting it go at that may be very, very preferable to having certain stern acolytes pop round to 'interview' you one dark night in relation to reported 'misty-meaners' you may or may not have committed against The People.

Do you grasp the nub of my gist now, Officer? ... because if you don't, well, you're not going to be told a second time.

author by jbpublication date Sun Jun 09, 2002 20:39author address author phone Report this post to the editors

author by jbpublication date Sun Jun 09, 2002 21:04author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Much of the defence of the garda thuggery has taken the form of allegation or insinuation that the garda were 'provoked' or that there were violent attacks on the gardai before they attacked the protest.
What has struck me is that almost all the areas of the garda attacks are covered 24/7 by an expensive CCTV system supplied to the gardai at the taxpayers expense. I believe it cost at least £500k. This is operated from a bank of TV screens in Pearse Street Garda Station. The equipment when installed was widely touted to the media as necessary to stamp out 'street crime'(?).
Given the relative costs of the equipment to the handheld digicams used by indymedia etc one would imagine the gardai could have recorded at least some instances of the alleged attacks on gardai.
They would have been only too ready to distribute these to the media in the days after the event if such existed.
It is also certain that the CCTV recorded many minutes of the gardai actions on that day and that such video evidence in it's entirety would have a bearing on criminal charges being faced by many citizens.
This being the case the defence teams should have the right to examine the CCTV evidence in it's entirety. Any failure to provide this evidence would constitue a denial of the right to mount a defence.
if not interference in the administration of justice.
I believe it is practically certain they did record many instances of gardai crime but that on past experience they would do their utmost to conceal or destroy this evidence. After all where should a CCTV camera system be pointed if there's a 'disturbance' under it's nose?
If the video evidence is present it will convict the guilty and acquit the innocent. If the CCTV evidence is absent or incomplete it's absence points to a conspiracy on the part of the gardai to pervert the course of Justice.
JB

author by trev maddenpublication date Thu Jun 13, 2002 21:37author email kotiknz at yahoo dot co dot nzauthor address author phone Report this post to the editors

an girlie chicaleeni
defenders of the common good
more like an garda siochana the brutt force

author by just a personpublication date Fri Jun 14, 2002 12:39author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Why some of you lot are so surprised by what the pigs are doing to us? what do you expect from a bunch of single-minded unachievers that make up the police force? Can you imagine a smart creative and social person with a life to live joining the police? NO!!
These people are smart as cucumbers and have the ambition of a goldfish. No wonder why they see themselfs as power-rangers. That's the type of personel the lords of this world need to keep the free thinkers quite and herd the already conquered sheep. Dum, cooperative and full of passion for their mission.
So don't stand there in the comfort of your armchair and your bowl of popcorn wondering WHY?
The streets are out there waiting for you

author by Mollypublication date Mon Jun 17, 2002 19:54author address author phone Report this post to the editors

The Gardai are 'dum'? Can ambition survive without a brain???

author by vITORpublication date Mon Jul 08, 2002 15:53author address author phone Report this post to the editors

I really like ireland,never been there but its on my to do list, always wanted to go and i will, very very soon....about the gardai, we had political repression here in brasil for 26 years,and they did things exactly like what happened,so im simpathetic...

but always remember , keep your friends close , but your enemies even closer

author by Flangebiscuit - Trumpet association for the deafpublication date Wed Jul 10, 2002 14:02author email bart at hotmail dot comauthor address xxxauthor phone 086 345 1233Report this post to the editors

People of this page

a)Learn to spell

b)Learn to protest with your hearts, not your ego's.

author by Cassiuspublication date Fri Aug 09, 2002 12:20author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Come on the ol' Bill! Its a shame they couldnt give a few more of u a kickin!! Why dont u all fuck off and get jobs and stop pissing everyone off with your ridiculous protests!!
Fight the power, Have a shower!!

author by karlpublication date Mon Aug 12, 2002 02:01author address author phone Report this post to the editors

you idiot! you braught an alcoholic drink onto the streets, the guard had ebery right to arrest you but instead used his discretion and was lenient. He simply took it off you and let you go. So what do you do to this decent guard? you use the camera that just happened to be in your pocket and take pictures, for what? what was your complaint? At least you admit to going for the guard but was it really only after you were hit? Im going to point out something that should be f**king obvious: the guards are trained to uphold the law, off course they should be able to control a mob, especially if force is required. Would you sleep better in your bed if they couldnt apprehend criminals? If they were afraid to confront someone thats commiting a crime? They wouldnt be very good at thier jobs would they? A job thats badly underpaid I might add. Did you know they start at ir£12,500.00 a year? and thats after going through the 2-3 year recruitment process,6 months in templemore and stationed anywhere in the country. Compare that to civil servants who start at ir13,500.00 straight away, get flexi time, no shift work, no pressure of any kind and whos getting 13% to keep up in the private sector? Who oput there would be a guard or that money when you can sit around scratching a get more?

author by ex rts-erpublication date Thu May 03, 2012 00:16author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Wow is this really ten years ago?
Baptism of fire for indymedia.ie back then.

Good to see RTS back in Dame Street again (although I do hope they take over a street rather than a pedestrian square next time...!! :-)

author by Joe Mc - SBU publication date Thu May 03, 2012 14:05author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Yes , you’d have to ask how Indymedia turned ino such a damp squib after its fiery baptism. People shouldn't be putting all the blame on Opus taking root here five years ago . The rot had already set in by that time .

author by tomeile_joe watchpublication date Thu May 03, 2012 16:48author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Don't downplay your own role in trying to sabotage this site every chance you get joe / tomeile etc etc.
Whoever you are, despite how shite you say this site is, you still spend a lot of your time posting here.
I can only assume, since you think it is shit and the articles are shit and the editors are all shit, then the only reason left for coming on here as opposed to going elsewhere instead would be personal gain of some sort.
Paid to monitor / sabotage perhaps??

author by JoeMcpublication date Fri May 04, 2012 13:39author address author phone Report this post to the editors


An obvious fan of Indymedia Ireland thinks that I am getting paid to sabotage the site and is going potty . I think I know who this fan may be .He mentions my role in his favourite website’s demise but not the people in charge of the site .An analogy . Your favourite soccer team starts playing badly , the club gets dramatically lower attendances at matches and can’t raise finances to stagger on for another year . I can understand supporters putting up with it for a season – you’re a loyal fan it could all just be a temporary glitch. But then if things keep going downhill ; if your club gets relegated to lower divisions a few years in a row , then your loyalty –not to the team itself but to the people in charge of it – would get tested I would have thought. The genuinely loyal fan would start asking a few questions about the club’s aloof board of directors.

author by JoeMcpublication date Fri May 04, 2012 13:50author address author phone Report this post to the editors

The previous poster suggested that I was being paid to undermine or to monitor indymedia ireland but doesn't say who he thinks may be paying me or to what end .

Anybody who was monitoring the site for money wouldn’t want to sabotage it at the same time -it would be a handy little earner for such a person . His puppet-masters would also want to keep the site going , surely?

author by tomeile_joe watchpublication date Fri May 04, 2012 14:12author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Yes joe, but if someone is paying you, they expect to see tangible results for their money don't they? So you would still have to do some real damage or you would be fired pretty quickly. I think you and your ilk have succeeded there and perhaps as a reward you've earned your retirement stipend for light monitoring and reporting duties, putting the occasional boot in when the opportunity presents itself to do further harm?.

And internet monitoring duty likely does not consist of monitoring just a single website so if one drops away, there are still others to be getting on with. I'm sure talented agents are charged with a wide range of duties.

A nasty virus often kills individual patients, but that does not mean the virus is not successful overall.

Or maybe you're not being paid. Maybe you just undermine for the fun of it. Just some sad bored frustrated smart but underachieving bedroom keyboard jockey who tries to destroy the efforts of others because he himself cannot create anything.

Tell us about yourself joe.... we'd love to know!

author by JoeMcpublication date Fri May 04, 2012 15:41author address author phone Report this post to the editors


The last poster thinks I’m being paid “a stipend for light monitoring and reporting duties” ,which sounds like the sort of thing you see on a postcard advertising CE schemes in job centre windows . But once again I have to ask , who would be paying me to do all that and why? In a magazine interview a couple of months ago an Indymedia editor –speaking anonymously ! - expressed the opinion that indymedia was “a leftish site” . Now , who would want to pay somebody to monitor such a vaguely “leftish” site?

The poster takes the “logical” view that “a nasty virus often kills individual patients, but that does not mean the virus is not successful overall. “ . I’m not sure if I follow the logic completely , but would say that it depends on whether you are the patient or the virus.

Indignant indyfan who has been watching me has concluded that that I’m either a well-paid spy doing light monitoring duties or else some “sad bored frustrated smart but underachieving bedroom keyboard jockey” who is having a bit of fun by undermining Indymedia ireland . Light monitoring duties in an unpaid post ? No thanks .
( I can just about see the ad for that btw Successful candidates will work from home, and be smart , sad and underachieving . )

author by JoeMc - SBU publication date Sat May 05, 2012 14:09author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Originally posted by Joe McIvor Fri May 04, 2012 16:37
The main finding of the tame UK parliamentary committee report published yesterday into the activities of News International and its global parent, News Corp was that Rupert Murdoch is not a fit person to run the group he heads. Why must the Irish left remain loyal to its own hierarchies?

Murdoch’s gang is actually far more open than the anonimista crowd that runs this site . Who are the seven people that sift through your Indymedia comments everyday and decide whether you are being “off topic” “unsubstantiated” “trolling” , “abusive” etc - can anybody name more than one of the seven editors ? By Indymedia’s own constitution not a single present member of the editorial board has the right to hold their position . “6.1 No member shall remain as a list moderator or a list secretary for a consecutive period of longer than 1 year.”
All of the present moderators have served for at least three years consecutively.

The site archives have been down for a month now . Indymedia moderators who think they have the right to pass judgement on what other people write have never once thought to volunteer any information about the fact that the hidden posts are no longer being recorded on the site archives. If the situation becomes permanent , the power of censorship afforded to moderators by themselves will be complete . That’s when my involvement with the site will cease .

Indymedia Ireland editors past and present should take careful note of the fact that the report on the News International scandal uses the terms “wilful blindness” and “willful ignorance” several times in relation to News Corps board members’ deliberate lack of oversight in the News Of the World phone hacking scandal .
See: http://www.wsws.org/articles/2012/may2012/murd-m04.shtm...upert Murdoch “not a fit person”, UK parliamentary committee finds

author by tomeile_joe watchpublication date Sat May 05, 2012 16:31author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Laughable comparison Joe and deliberate attempts to mislead anyone reading this about the workings of this site. Typical joe/tomeile fare.

joe troll: "Murdoch’s gang is actually far more open than the anonimista crowd that runs this site."

Horseshit. nobody here taps people's phones and blackmails them, (although in contrast some of our own communications may have been subject to monitoring). And this tiny insignificant website has nothing remotely like the insidious media penetration of an empire like murdoch's who amongst many other things runs fox news. we just help run a tiny website which gets some news out which otherwise might not see the light. So damn right Its Imperative that a dangerously monopolistic and influential media empire like murdochs has checks and balances. This site has adequate peer review and openness for its size. Certainly much more than others I could name beginning with "P" where you can get a lifetime ban for one single comment. (I did myself)

joe troll: "Who are the seven people that sift through your Indymedia comments everyday and decide whether you are being “off topic” “unsubstantiated” “trolling” , “abusive” etc - can anybody name more than one of the seven editors?"

To Reiterate our procedures, no comments are ever actually deleted here, just hidden from view if they derail discussion etc. All comments hidden or otherwise and direct public access to the decision process are (normally) available to subscribers to our lists. Anybody can do so. There is (normally) an audit trail for each editorial decision.

Regarding knowing personal details of moderators, Is that really so important if the process itself is transparent?? Can anyone name the people running RTE? The Irish times? P.ie moderators? Are their processes as transparent as the one we aspire to here?

All current Indymedia volunteers are well known in the activist community. One volunteer chooses to remain anonymous to avoid personal attacks / stalking from trolls etc, that person is also directly involved in the activist community. How many of the people running RTE, P.ie, Irish times etc (or news international) are directly involved in the activist community?

joe troll: "By Indymedia’s own constitution not a single present member of the editorial board has the right to hold their position . “6.1 No member shall remain as a list moderator or a list secretary for a consecutive period of longer than 1 year.”
All of the present moderators have served for at least three years consecutively."


I think you are DELIBERATELY mixing up "Newswire moderator" with "list moderator"(either that or you can't read properly which I very much doubt). These are two very different things. (Newswire moderators don't have the same condition of rotation imposed upon them and may do this job as long as they can stand it. It's not exactly fun reading through reams of comments, being abused by trolls like yourself, or regularly insulted by the Irish right all the time just for helping to maintain a non corporate free and open publishing website and keeping this facility available to the Irish people against the odds.

You moan a lot about comments being hidden (but still available and readable) but the fact is actual proper news articles are rarely hidden here in practice, (except for a handful of well known regular spammers). We even continue to allow people like yourself to continue to publish articles despite the fact that you persist in making extra work for us week in week out, sabotage the site and make personal attacks on the volunteers here at every opportunity. Hows that for "censorship"?

joe troll: "The site archives have been down for a month now . Indymedia moderators who think they have the right to pass judgement on what other people write have never once thought to volunteer any information about the fact that the hidden posts are no longer being recorded on the site archives."

Bullshit. We informed people in a big red notice at the top of the newswire. If we get sufficient donations to fix our broken hardware and pay for our hosting then we will be able to restore the site to it's full functionality and it is our intention to do so

joe troll: "If the situation becomes permanent , the power of censorship afforded to moderators by themselves will be complete . That’s when my involvement with the site will cease ."

Must you wait? you've been largely a hateful troll on this site joe / tom. If you dislike it so much you should go to P.ie. to spread your troll love instead. And tempting as the prospect of getting rid of one very persistent and devious troll is, despite what you say to the contrary, we are all ethical principled volunteers here and we won't behave in the unacceptable manner you describe. Sorry to disappoint. Subscribers to our lists know moderators here are all individuals who think for themselves and regularly discuss, debate and disagree with comment hides and vote to reinstate comments they feel were erroneously hidden. Our process is slow and has its issues but we are trying and you know that very well.

joe troll: "Indymedia Ireland editors past and present should take careful note of the fact that the report on the News International scandal uses the terms “wilful blindness” and “willful ignorance” several times in relation to News Corps board members’ deliberate lack of oversight in the News Of the World phone hacking scandal .
See: http://www.wsws.org/articles/2012/may2012/murd-m04.shtm...upert Murdoch “not a fit person”, UK parliamentary committee finds"


Comparing indymedia to news international is laughable. Is that the best trolling you can do today Joe/tom? Perhaps you need a holiday?. You might Come back refreshed and invigourated to attack the site more creatively? This is far from your best work.

Your post proves my point that you are only here to try to harm this site. Otherwise how can you explain your continued and regular presence on a site you have nothing but negativity toward? I ask you again: Please do tell us something about yourself. If you stand behind your comments and truly want them to be taken seriously then revealing your identity and standing behind your relentless criticism of this website might give you a little more credibility. Go on, tell us about yourself and your own work in the activist community joe(arresting / shopping protesters doesn't count!), and what exactly gives you the moral high ground to attack the work of volunteers on this site who are actually trying to do something positive, week after week?.

author by JoeMcIvorpublication date Sun May 06, 2012 13:16author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Editors feel they have the right to break the site’s guidelines whenever it suits them . The posts calling me a paid police informer and written under the user name “tomeile/joewatch” are clearly coming from the indymedia editorial board . That’s what you have to accept when you post here . If anonymous moderators disagree with your opinions they will try to stitch you up somehow . This is not the first lie - nor the worst one - told about me by indymedia ireland's editorial board to shut me up .

This “tiny” site received 300,000 IP hits a month in 2007. Don’t blame me for chasing all the readers away . The editor who posted the smear about me has personally put up articles and comments on a number of occasions that she knew would be offensive to the vast majority of those site users . Catholics , Muslims meat-eaters bereaved family members of hunters - anybody who doesn’t ascribe to the editorial board's consensual interpretation of the site’s “libertarian” ethos become legitimate targets for indymedia's editors .Moderators devise insults of the vilest nature to direct at what must be ninety-nine percent of the Irish population ;they defend and post the grossest Islamophobic and sectarian cartoons that they can find to test whether Christians or Muslims are as tolerant of such images as themselves . And then have the gall to ask people to contibute to their save the steeple fund ! On Good Friday this year , readers took offence -as was intended - to a poster published on this site by editorial board members . The “Crucifixion Party” poster had invited people to masturbate over images of a crucified Jesus Christ. The reasonably worded complaints of Christians either got censored with the usual excuses or else the “kill joy” protesters were accused of being the Spanish Inquisition . Wageslave, go show your “ cum here” pictures to your mother- she may be able to tell you why “readership is falling”.

author by opus diablos - the regressive hypocrite partypublication date Sun May 06, 2012 14:29author address author phone Report this post to the editors

..is it Joe?

Like your comment on me back up above, when I had never even posted on the thread...and giving me three years longer posting on Indy than the records support???

You are an arsehole troll...end of story. Obviously I've annoyed you somewhere with factual posts you could not controvert, so the resentment smoulders.

Grow a brain. Or are you paid to remain thick?

author by JoeMcpublication date Sun May 06, 2012 15:18author address author phone Report this post to the editors

I was actually defending you from the people who have been trying to blame you entirely for the site's demise .

author by tomeile_joe watchpublication date Sun May 06, 2012 17:04author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Tomeile/joe the troll: "Editors feel they have the right to break the site’s guidelines whenever it suits them . "

Rather than hiding them as per the guidelines as usual, an editor responded directly to your lies this time in an effort to clarify the persistent misinformation about this site being propagated by you.

Tomeile/joe the troll: "The posts calling me a paid police informer and written under the user name “tomeile/joewatch” are clearly coming from the indymedia editorial board . That’s what you have to accept when you post here"

Nah, we reserve that special treatment for extremely persistent long term trolls like you with whom we have lost patience and are completely exasperated by.

Tomeile/joe the troll: "If anonymous moderators disagree with your opinions they will try to stitch you up somehow . This is not the first lie - nor the worst one - told about me by indymedia ireland's editorial board to shut me up "

Coming from a devious and consummate liar and "stitcher up" of volunteers on this site, that's rather funny.

Someone merely asked the glaringly obvious question as to why someone who dislikes everything about this site and the volunteers running it so much and who takes every opportunity to try to run it down and spread lies about it, and personally attack the volunteers keeping it going, would continue coming here and regularly posting instead of just going elsewhere.

They merely suggested some possible conclusions as to your possible motivations. Sadly, you're unlikely to ever shut up. Whatever your motivation may be

Tomeile/joe the troll: "This “tiny” site received 300,000 IP hits a month in 2007. Don’t blame me for chasing all the readers away"

Well you certainly work hard to discourage everyone else from coming here, despite the fact that you continue to do so very regularly yourself!! Curious behaviour that.

Tomeile/joe the troll: "The editor who posted the smear about me has personally put up articles and comments on a number of occasions that she knew would be offensive to the vast majority of those site users"

"the vast majority"?? Sounds like a lot of people. Ahem... I thought nobody read this site anymore according to you. If so then nobody is reading the articles posted here anyway, so nobody has been offended. Can't have it both ways Joe.

One should not attenuate one's speech based on the feigned "offence" of others. Otherwise one might never speak again!

"Offence" is a form of emotional blackmail and just another tool of censorship.

Actually censorship is mostly what you complain about yourself Joe. I guess you are anti censorship, except when it offends somebody religious!

You're an enigma wrapped in a conondrum wrapped in a (vegetarian) taco Joe

Tomeile/joe the troll: "Catholics , Muslims meat-eaters bereaved family members of hunters - anybody who doesn’t ascribe to the editorial board's consensual interpretation of the site’s “libertarian” ethos become legitimate targets for indymedia's editors .
Moderators devise insults of the vilest nature to direct at what must be ninety-nine percent of the Irish population.",


Yes you are right Joe. We arrange special meetings to plot how next we will insult 99% of the Irish people. At these special meetings we craft and devise special insults which we rate on a scale of 1-10 for insultivity. Afterwards we snack on babies. Can I have some of what you are on. It induces paranoia but otherwise it seems like some really strong shit.

It's interesting how someone who claims to be "not at all religious" is such an armchair champion of religion. Are you one of those "atheists" Joe? A godless infidel that should be put to the sword perhaps? Do tell.

Tomeile/joe the troll: "They defend and post the grossest Islamophobic and sectarian cartoons that they can find to test whether Christians or Muslims are as tolerant of such images as themselves."

Yep. God/Allah told us to set it up. Its all a carefully crafted test. If they pass they go straight to heaven! You fail so no virgins for you. Sorry. Moderators don't write most of the articles here, the public do Joe.

Tomeile/joe the troll: "And then have the gall to ask people to contibute to their save the steeple fund! On Good Friday this year , readers took offence -as was intended - to a poster published on this site by editorial board members.

This poster was not posted by any editorial members. Again, this is a complete lie plain and simple.

Since you insist on posting so much here, will you be actually be contributing to our save the steeple fund Joe?

From what Joe/tomeile is saying, you'd think all that ever gets posted here was attacks on religion and blasphemous imagery but guess what, that only constitutes a miniscule proportion of the articles and event notices posted on indymedia. Most of the articles are about social justice of one kind or another. Why would joe/tom wish to greatly exaggerate this small aspect so much if not to deliberately try to divisively attack this website? Certainly looks like he has a particular agenda to me!

Tomeile/joe the troll: "The “Crucifixion Party” poster had invited people to masturbate over images of a crucified Jesus Christ. The reasonably worded complaints of Christians either got censored with the usual excuses or else the “kill joy” protesters were accused of being the Spanish Inquisition"

We generally do not respond to people trying to pressure us to censor posts on our site on the basis of religious deference. This is a good thing. Sharia law has not yet been implemented in Ireland yet.
And I guess if we had agreed to hide the post, it would have been "censorship". Can't win either way can we?

Tomeile/joe the troll: "go show your “ cum here” pictures to your mother- she may be able to tell you why “readership is falling”.

I did. And your mom too!
Both thought the conversion to a lossy format with a very high compression ratio reduced detail and clarity of the images. ;-)

I find your post highly offensive as it mentions my mom and cum in the same sentence. Is there anything in the koran about linking peoples mother with graphic sexual innuendo? Is it the usual case of "putting them to the sword"? ;-)

Thats the trouble with medievil texts. They never can directly address the pressing modern social problems of today very well. Personally, I think a mild stoning would probably do. (none of that really strong skunk tho!) ;-)

author by opus diablos - the regressive hypocrite partypublication date Mon May 07, 2012 09:53author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Problem there, idiot, is that there is no reference to me other than yours.

Grow a cell, if you can't manage a full cortex.

author by JoeMcpublication date Mon May 07, 2012 11:33author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Opus ,why these insults to me ? There were plenty of references of the "Shut the fuck up Opus" "will you ever fuck off Opus " variety . I most certainly was not responsible for posting any of them . How would I know whether or not you are a " drunken ex-choir boy from Crumlin" ?

"opus trying to pretend that he is an intellectual " "opus the latin scholar ha ha ". "Shut TFU Opus" Check out the hidden articles list summary .

author by tomeile_joe watchpublication date Mon May 07, 2012 11:34author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Joe. we asked opus not to respond to trolls, wheras you ARE a troll. There is a huge difference. Opus is not out to deliberately harm this site. You on the other hand are. Opus realises this too. And clearly Opus is wise enough to know a divisive troll when one tries to use him without his permission!!

author by JoeMcpublication date Mon May 07, 2012 12:13author address author phone Report this post to the editors


What a load of baloney coming from wageslave there “using Opus without permission”- a new one for the reason to hide list perhaps ? Opus, the fact that the Indymedia ireland editorial board is responding to me at all means that they don’t really consider me as a troll . Whatever else about them , editorial board members are “wise” enough to know that you don’t feed trolls let alone discuss editorial matters with them .

author by opus diablos - the regressive hypocrite partypublication date Mon May 07, 2012 12:52author address author phone Report this post to the editors

you're just a misunderstood genius...

Except your modus operandum is blatantly transparent. Can you not up your childish game to a credible level?

I am curious though as to why your shite is not just deleted.Unless its to illustrate the trite shite of the vacuous.

author by tomeile_joe watchpublication date Mon May 07, 2012 18:35author address author phone Report this post to the editors

No joe/tom, you ARE a troll. I have just decided this time to engage with you and maybe counter some of your deliberate attempts at misinformation.

Generally not feeding the trolls is the correct response, but you are a different level of troll to the normal one. You have been at it now for a long time on this site for whatever reasons, and whether we feed you or not, you still keep at it.

So why not tell us more about yourself Joe. We're curious. And We'd also like to know your motivations for this protracted antagonism towards us, both as a site and personally as individuals. There are many sites on the internet. Why choose this one to attack and undermine persistently over such a long period of time?

author by tomeile_joe watchpublication date Mon May 07, 2012 19:19author address author phone Report this post to the editors

by the way, Joe
Nice one, reposting a bunch of insults aimed at another poster by way of examples. Insulting whilst pretending not to be.

Just to clarify, Those insults were not originally posted by anyone in the editorial collective. Just some troll. They were promptly hidden.

It could possibly have been joe's alter ego though. He certainly seems pretty familiar with these comments.

If you want I will hide the quoted insults Opus.
They are certainly breaking our rules. (but then again this whole conversation is!)

author by opus diablos - the regressive hypocrite partypublication date Tue May 08, 2012 08:23author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Naw...he'd have to do better than that for me to be insulted...

I actually take it as flattery that I've annoyed some hasbara pump-handler or spindustrialist communications clinician to set this poodle-fart loose and probably promised it a bonus if it can close the site or disrupt enough.

It illustrates nicely the level of malicious idiocy those who strip the masks off our political managers can expect to evoke.

Your choice, it does sort of clutter the space. And probably does what he's been instructed to do, puts neutral readers off. At the end of the day its rather sad and pathetic. A bit like watching a dying rat...

Or maybe its some vatican acolyte getting trained, judging by all its anal references.

author by tomeile_joe watchpublication date Tue May 08, 2012 11:48author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Joe / tom refuses to tell us even a little bit about himself and his motivations for such a long and protracted trolling campaign of many years against the indymedia website and the volunteers keeping it going and instead has resorted to more personal attacks under a pseudonym against one of the moderators (hidden for obvious reasons). It is clear that he has no intention other than doing harm and is not open to discussion. Accordingly this communication is closed.

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