Sargent calls Shannon action 'regrettable'

by Pat C Mon Feb 03, 2003 16:40

Let him know that you are disgusted at his comments. Also let him know that the Peace Camp does not have a monopoly on actions to be taken at Shannon.

Who elected the Peace Camp? Fair play to those who choose to stay there, but they can not have a veto on action to be taken. By its very nature, the action taken by Mary & the five cannot be broadcast or openly discussed iun advance.

It would of course be better if we had mass action. As Andrew put it, if 5,000 go over the wire then no one could stop them.

Contact:
trevor.sargent@oireachtas.ie
6183465
Sargent, Trevor (Green Party (Technical Group)
Sargent, Trevor
37 Tara Cove, Balbriggan, Co. Dublin

Let the Greens know of your disgust:
The Green Party 618 4088 srawson@oireachtas.ie

by conor - (wsm personal capacity) Mon Feb 03, 2003 16:40

"behold the good and just whom do they hate most, him who breaketh up their tables of values, the breaker, the law breaker; he, however; is the creator"

Nietzsche (thus spoke Zarathustra)

(if a catholic worker can smash up a plane this atheist worker can at least stand by them)

conor

by Aidan Hehir - Green Party Mon Feb 03, 2003 16:51

I fully agree with Trevor Sargeant's assessment of last nights actions.
As far as I am concerned, direct action is necessary in certain situations and can have great effect if carefully carried out.
However, for any campaign to be effective it must have mass support. The campaign in Shannon WAS receiving huge support locally and nationally. Now however, I fear people will distance themselves from the campaign and fall back into believing the media sterotyping of the peace protesters. We must not allow ourselves to belive we can achieve sucess without a groundswell of support amongst the ordinary people. Acting unilaterally is both arrogant and potentially counter productive. When all other avenues have been exhausted, then direct action is necessary. Much more could have been done before resorting to these measures. It is not for a group of religious zealouts to determine how a mass campaign sholu proceed.
In addition any action taken should be in accordance with those at the Shannon Peace Camp. I fear they are the ones who will most feel the backlash...

by Graham Caswell - Green Party Mon Feb 03, 2003 16:54

Green Party Leader, Trevor Sargent T.D., reacting to this morning's incident at Shannon, said today, "Certainly the focus of the peace campaign at Shannon is not helped with this new action. We understand people's frustrations
regarding the actions of the Irish Government in blatantly allowing the US military to use Shannon in what is quite clearly a massive military build-up to another invasion in Iraq."

"The incident is regrettable and constitutes a distraction from the main issues of the peace campaign in the build-up to war. Nor is it helped by the exaggerated claims by the Government in relation to the incident, that is, the alleged assault on a Garda which we believe has no basis in fact."

Mr. Sargent said whether the law had been broken or not would ultimately be decided by the courts, but he noted that the actions had not been endorsed by the peace camp protestors at the airport, and appeared to be part of a 'solo
run' by a particular group.

"The public must understand that what is happening right now is not a 'wait and see' situation. Ordinary Iraqi people have suffered dreadfully over the last decade as a result of sanctions and even last week were being bombed by
Anglo-American warplanes trying to destroy radar equipment. How can the Government and the media claim there is no war yet in Iraq when civilians are being bombed on a daily basis?"

by Aidan Mon Feb 03, 2003 17:02

Not that there is any trouble. It was a peaceful act and all this talk of "overpowering a garda" or "assault" is an invention. Well done lads and lassies, keep it up. Make it untenable for them to bring in their death machines.

by Aidan - IMC Ireland Mon Feb 03, 2003 17:04

Wasn't me.

by Andrew Mon Feb 03, 2003 17:11

What on earth are the "main issues of the peace campaign" that Sergent is worried about? Surely our involvement in the war through refuelling at Shannon is THE main issue. Far from distracting from this last nights action has put it in as number one item on the news again. Or does 'holding onto my seat' count as the main issue? In that context just which group is it that is carrying out a 'solo run'.

As to Aidans comments surely he knows that the movement against refueling at Shannon actually started with a number of direct action protests at the airport over a year ago. Indeed Mary Kelly was detained by the cops at one of these for going over the fence. So if it is popular locally then it is popular because of protests that have already included Direct action tactics.

The war is on, and has been for years. Soon it will escalate massively. I'm not sure what "other avenues" Aidan wants to "exhaust" before he will allow others to take direct action. Many of us feel these are not only a waste of time but have already been exhausted (we already had a Dail vote).

Overall it is very dishonest of those who oppose the action to pretend that 'Catholic Worker' are the only ones who favour direct action while the rest of the anti-war movements oppose it. The reality is that there is a substantial minority of the movement that not only favours direct action but that has acted now on half a dozen occasions. And this is happening not just in Ireland but across the globe, see the actions listed at the linked web site

by conor (wsm opersonal capacity) Mon Feb 03, 2003 17:23

OK last one b4 I go and do something use ful with my life !

Direct Action?
by Aidan Hehir - Green Party Mon, Feb 3 2003, 3:51pm

I fully agree with Trevor Sargeant's assessment of last nights actions.
As far as I am concerned, direct action is necessary in certain situations and can have great effect if carefully carried out.

>>>>>>
Here here
fully agree

AH: However, for any campaign to be effective it must have mass support.

>>>>>>
68% of people are against the war according to the last MRBI poll - we now enjoy that support - what, now, can we do to stop the boms - smart and stoopid from raining down on people's heads in Iraq !

AH:The campaign in Shannon WAS receiving huge support locally and nationally. Now however, I fear people will distance themselves from the campaign and fall back into believing the media sterotyping of the peace protesters.

>>>>>>
The media stereo type of peace protestors and lefties is that they sit on their fat arses and do nothing except make vague appeals and whinges. We aren't supposed to be effective. we aren't supposed to actually do anything ! We aren't supposed to actually effect real issues in the rea world but now..........

For the first time in a long time - people - incensed and angry - are moving the debate forward!

- most people I talked to about Mary Kelly's action supported it - some thought "it was a bit too much" NO ONE even fairly right wing people either condemened her or supported the war
where I work is a fairly right wing catholic school !
The main reason locals might be annoyed is the job argument - It would be nice to have ACCURATE figurse from Aer Rianta on the economic contribution to Shannon

There is a patronising assumption that "ordinary people" ARE ALWAYS pissed off and dismayed by direct action.
This is NOT always the case
- some times seeing that some one will actually put their money where their mouth is can be a real tonic.
Plus this is costing the state - money lots of it, bad publicity and suspicious glances from their lords and masters in the States

AH:We must not allow ourselves to belive we can achieve sucess without a groundswell of support amongst the ordinary people.

>>>>>>
I think we've got that - what now do nothing ?

AH:Acting unilaterally is both arrogant and potentially counter productive. When all other avenues have been exhausted, then direct action is necessary. Much more could have been done before resorting to these measures.

>>>>>>
like what? - these planes are moving men and material over too slaughter people - when is action "allowed to happen"

AH:It is not for a group of religious zealouts to determine how a mass campaign sholu proceed.

>>>>>>
Tactically I have some sympathy for your position as personally I would see mass, democratic action as being better then individual "martyr" type action - in fairness though these individuals acted with courage and within their view of what was moral and ethical - they have not sought to IMPOSE their views on others
- they have not offered any advice as to how the "mass campaign" should proceed.

I will though
- it should proceed through that fecking fence as soon as possible !

AH:In addition any action taken should be in accordance with those at the Shannon Peace Camp. I fear they are the ones who will most feel the backlash...

>>>>>>
There may be some truth in that - but everyone has to determine their own actions and I don't think any group - how ever genuine, should be allowed to decide what others can or can't do - the catholic workers haven't told any one how they are "allowed to proceed" neither should we

related link: struggle.ws/stopthewar.html

Conor

by pat c Mon Feb 03, 2003 17:33

" The campaign in Shannon WAS receiving huge support locally and nationally. Now however, I fear people will distance themselves from the campaign and fall back into believing the media sterotyping of the peace protesters."

What are you basing this on? If anything support has grown through out the country since the previous actions.

" Acting unilaterally is both arrogant and potentially counter productive. "

What does this mean? Should they have your permission before they act? No one has elected a Central Committee to decide on which actions are permissible. By its very nature these actiuons cannot be publicly announced beforehand.

It would be better if 5,000 went over the wire , who could stop that many?

"In addition any action taken should be in accordance with those at the Shannon Peace Camp."

Arrant nonsense! Why should a small bunch of activists have a veto over all of those who are opposed to the WAr?

"I fear they are the ones who will most feel the backlash..."

What is this supposed to mean? Are they going to be shot? Transported to the Colonies?

Cop yourself on.

by Pissed off Mon Feb 03, 2003 18:22

Are you serious about trying to stop this war? Do you really think that another speech by Patricia McKenna or Michael D will stop the war?

by Syliva Pankhurst Mon Feb 03, 2003 19:38

As the Green Party is supposedly a non-hierarchial consenus blah blah ..I would love to know if/when they voted on Trevor's position..and if it is endorsed by the mass of rank and file Green party members .....if not will Trevor be someways disciplined for coming out with this, which is surely a betrayal of the rank and file Greens who canvassed for the Party, stuck up posters etc.... (I would be suprised if there was a "consensus" among Green Party members which echoed Trevor's postion, and if there isn't or if there is a difference of views, by what right does Trevor use the position he has won, because of the Green party, to promlogate this viewpoint).

Eventually they will be like the German Green Party --- mayors who order the police in against anti-nuclear demonstrators, ministers who order the troops into Kosovo and Afghanistan (and into Kuwait currently, and into protecting U.S. bases in Germant so more U.S. troops can go to the Gulf).

by Sylvia Pankhurst Mon Feb 03, 2003 20:24

Green Party Leader, Trevor Sargent T.D., reacting:

"Certainly the focus of the peace campaign at Shannon is not helped with this new action. We understand people's frustrations
regarding the actions of the Irish Government.... "

Note it is claimed here that the five peeps did not rationally decide what is or is not an effective tactic they are motivated by irational frustration, i.e. everyone that does not agree with Trevor on a tactical question is in actual fact irrational.

"The incident is regrettable and constitutes a distraction from the main issues of the peace campaign in the build-up to war."

A distraction????? The only way for people in Ireland to impact on the war is through preventing the use of Shannon for military purposes...now how do we do that other than direct action...simple fucking question....certainly it is necessary to build a movement ...a rally where old hacks like me can be bored stupid listening to stupid politicans might be a part of that...certainly not everyone *has* to participate in direct action...leafleting, postering, organising meetings all the more mundane stuff is essential....but where is the cutting edge.... if public opinion mattered to the government then the Shannon thing wouldn't be happening in the first place..if massive protests marches mattered to the government then why is the London govt. about to go to war despite all the massive marches in London over the last year....you need a cutting edge be it anything from boycot, to strike, to non-payment, to property destruction....

On the other hand we could just vote for the Green party and eventually they would be in government and there would be no more war and the bosses would give away all their money and everyone would wear flowers in their hair......just like in Germany.

by ANGRY Mon Feb 03, 2003 22:36

HAVE ALL OF YOU LOST YOUR MINDS? HAVE YOU EVER DONE ANY RESEARCH ON A 737 AKA C40? YOU CAN LOOK IT UP ONLINE.....THEY DO NOT CARRY WEAPONS OR BOMBS NOT EVEN MISSLES. THE MONEY THAT WILL BE SPENT ON THIS COULD HAVE SAVED LIVES BY SENDING FOOD TO STARVING CHILDREN....THIS IS NOT A "WAR PLANE" DO SOME RESEARCH BEFORE YOU GO WASTING TAX PAYERS HARD EARNED DOLLARS FOR A ACT OF VIOLENCE.

by STUPID Mon Feb 03, 2003 23:50

I USE CAPS ALL THE TIME BECAUSE I AM THICK. I DONT UNDERSTAND WHY YOU WOULD WANT TO STOP A PLANE THAT IS PART OF AN AIRFORCE THAT IS USED FOR LOGISTICS IN ATTACKING IRAQ. WHY ARE YOU ALL SO UPSET THAT LITTLE BABIES ARE GOING TO DIE? I AM REALLY STUPID. PLEASE EXPLAIN IT TO ME. NO, DONT BOTHER I AM TOO STUPID TO UNDERSTAND ALL THE REASONS WRITTEN BEFORE.

by watcha Tue Feb 04, 2003 00:31

I know the Greens are crap on this (as well as bin charges) I am interested to hear what Sinn Fein says? will they support it? or Condemn it? And what about the swp it shows them up as being all talk and no action, what do they say about it

by dave lordan - swp Tue Feb 04, 2003 13:33

We congratulate the Catholic Workers Movement for their action against the us warplane. Anyone who takes direct action against the build up to war is justified. The weaponry these planes are capable of carrying can destroy millions of lives.
We will continue to argue for and organise for mass action against the war. We will place particular emphasis on large protests and trade union work. On the former because we believe large displays of public opposition are the most inclusive and effective way to politically undermine the war effort. On the latter because because the whole war effort rest son the co-operation of the workers who supply, service nad partake in war. We believe they can be won to striking against the war if we can build a large and broad movement against the war. On this basis we will work with anybody who is opposed to the war while, like the cwm, the peace camp, grassroots gathering, labour and everbody else
arguing and organbising for what we believe to be the best way to oppose the war.

by David Healy Tue Feb 04, 2003 15:04 verdire at eircom dot net

As a Green Party member and former Co. Councillor I am shocked and angered by Trevor Sargent's press statement.

David

by Syliva Pankhurst Tue Feb 04, 2003 15:15

Yes David my heart goes out to the many many decent people in the Green party who have been betrayed by this....time to recognise that a parliamentary road building stragegy is as costly, wasteful and hierarchial, as an actual road building strategy. Put them into power and you - the people that grafted for the party have no control over them (and this in a party which seems fairly democratic in comparasion to the rest).

by Ray Tue Feb 04, 2003 16:40

Trevor Sargent - The Turncoat!
by 'In the moment' Tue, Feb 4 2003, 3:27pm

.

Through the media, Trevor Sargent (Green party)showed support of 'mary kelly' action last week, then this week, does a u-turn with regards to the 'catholic worker' action saying it was 'regrettable'. The 'garda press office' since states that the garda was not attacked or injured. This lie being put out by Seamus Brennen (fine fail), the minister for transport, in order to discredit? the anti-war movement.

Apart from the obvious political hoodwink of Trevor Sargent by Seamus Brennen, yesturdays events in the media showed us that Trevor Sargent and the Green party will use the movement/issue to capitialise themselves politically over other partys in the Dail, but will also will be part of attempts to discredit/divide the movement when that Media situation occurs. That they were tricked into this shows a far amount of naivety on Trevors part at best, but also showed us that they are indeed closer to the the likes of fine fail than the myths they like to promote.

Further, since when does Trevor Sargent speak for the Peace camp? Since when does the Peace camp become some form of authority/legitamiser on Direct Action which he implies by saying "actions had not been endorsed by the peace camp protestors at the airport". this could be something the Peace Camp address?? have your names being taken in vain? is Trevor a spoke person for the Peace Camp? This also brings in,hopefully a constructive debate: should, and if so how,do groups such as the peace camp (not specifically) speak for themselves??

related link: www.indymedia.ie/cgi-bin/newswire.cgi?id=26741

add your comments

by E. Miesner Wed Feb 05, 2003 22:02

were thrilled when we heard the news of a U.S.
plane getting trashed in Ireland. We have some
of the most controlled media in the world. They
are trying to tell us that the U.S. has a lot of
international support for it's war against Iraq.
Many of us know otherwise. It is especially good
that this happened in Ireland because many
Americans see Ireland as their ethnic heritage.
Americans are NOT zenophobic towards Irish people.
The major media outlets here were completely
silent about the destruction of the plane, but
the millions of us who are enlightened enough to
read alternative news sources know what is
happening.

by Simon Thu Feb 06, 2003 14:15 Co. Clare

Obviously none of you have read the full statement by Trevor Sargent. Here it is:
3 February 2003
PEACE CAMPAIGN MUST REMAIN FOCUSSED ON HORRORS OF WAR IN IRAQ - Claims Green Party Leader, Sargent Green Party Leader, Trevor Sargent T.D., reacting to this morning’s incident at Shannon, said today, “Certainly the focus of the peace campaign at Shannon is not helped with this new action. We understand people’s frustrations regarding the actions of the Irish Government in blatantly allowing the US military to use Shannon in what is quite clearly a massive military build-up to another invasion in Iraq.” “The incident is regrettable and constitutes a distraction from the main issues of the peace campaign in the build-up to war. Nor is it helped by the exaggerated claims by the Government in relation to the incident, that is, the alleged assault on a Garda which we believe has no basis in fact.” Mr. Sargent said whether the law had been broken or not would ultimately be decided by the courts, but he noted that the actions had not been endorsed by the peace camp protestors at the airport, and appeared to be part of a 'solo run' by a particular group. “The public must understand that what is happening right now is not a “wait and see” situation. Ordinary Iraqi people have suffered dreadfully over the last decade as a result of sanctions and even last week were being bombed by Anglo-American warplanes trying to destroy radar equipment. How can the Government and the media claim there is no war yet in Iraq when civilians are being bombed on a daily basis?” INFORMATION

TREVOR SARGENT T.D. 8900360 / 087 254 7836

STEPHEN RAWSON PRESS OFFICER 6184088 / 087 235 7551

by Simon Thu Feb 06, 2003 14:17 Co. Clare

Here is a follow up statement by John Gormley.

4 February 2003
REAL TRUTH OF SHANNON PROTEST SHOULD BE TOLD - SAY GREENS

The Green Party today demanded that the full truth be disclosed about the break-ins at Shannon airport.

Green Party Chairman, John Gormley T.D., said that there had been a great deal of lies and distortion which he believed would prejudice the impending court cases of the protesters. “It has been widely reported that a Garda in Shannon was assaulted and subsequently hospitalised. If this incident had any basis in fact it would have been totally condemned by the Green Party. However, no charges for assault have been brought against the accused and it has now been confirmed that the Garda in question was not hospitalised. It is deplorable that there are certain sections of the media that would behave in such a irresponsible fashion.”

“Last week it was also widely reported that over 500,000 euro worth of damage was inflicted on a US military aircraft. Again, it is our understanding that this estimate is greatly exaggerated. These lies and distortions have been used to undermine the case of the Anti-War movement. It is therefore vital that the protesters do not continue to play into the hands of the warmongers and their allies. The Green Party has called on any protest to adhere strictly to a passive resistance code. We cannot afford to lose the battle for the hearts and minds of ordinary people.”

Mr. Gormley said that it was now quite clear that truth had, once again, been the first casualty of this war. “However, the Greens are confident that in the long term, the essential truth of our message will persuade people that this war is fundamentally wrong and unjustified.”

JOHN GORMLEY T.D. 087 2756 6135

STEPHEN RAWSON PRESS OFFICER 087 235 7551
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