Shameful activity

by Gaillimhed Wed Jan 29, 2003 10:44

Some would say that 'disarming' a US death machine is far from vandalism. The Shannon war protesters have let no-one down in their unrelenting resistance to WAR. They deserve our gratitude and respect, and most of all our assistance.

by Pete Ranks Wed Jan 29, 2003 11:06

The incursion of that protestor onto the runway of Shannon was the act of someone who is not afraid of doing what they can to try to stop the shameful use of our airport by the US. What else can they do? Petition their local TD? Fat lot of good that does. Our government has thrown our constitution out the window with regard to our neutrality. Direct action is what will stop the planes.

by Ray Wed Jan 29, 2003 11:18

Shameless Activity
by Prankster Wed, Jan 29 2003, 10:07am
The use of Shannon as a US airforce base........

add your comments

by Terry Wed Jan 29, 2003 12:32

On the same logic of our friend in the original posting above, damage
to the factories producing the gas that killed the Jews or perhaps to
'shower rooms' where the gas was dispensed or perhaps the crematoriums
would be considered vandalism even violence according to that line of reasoning.

Yes, you have certainly swallowed the "War is Peace" and "Strength through Ignorance" line!

by Brian J Goggin Wed Jan 29, 2003 13:16

So you were opposing the planned American smash-and-grab raid until you heard about this "vandalism"? And your disapproval of the "vandalism" outweighs your disapproval of the forthcoming murder of Iraqi men, women and children?

bjg

by Tony Mc Manus Wed Jan 29, 2003 15:39

I dont agree with the killing of anbody Brian. I also don't agree with vandalism. Simple as that. If I didn't agree with your viewpoint would I be justified in smashing all your windows and perhaps burning your car. What would that achieve???? The Shannon people were making their point well enough through the media without having to do this (third time actually). Anyhow, I can see that the Indymedia fans dont accept other peoples points of view.

by Garry - global action ucd Wed Jan 29, 2003 16:00

Tony,

Can you then answer the classic question, if a baby is inside a burning car, would you not break the window to save the baby? Of course you would. Therefore breaking car windows is not always vandalism. You cannot take an absolutist position that vandalism is always vandalism.

Just because the link isnt as direct, attacking a plane that is heading to war to kill civilians with a hatchett, doesnt mean it is vandalism, regardless of the blatant breaches of our own constitution, our laws and the hague convention.

UK peace activists who disarmed planes heading to East Timor in 1996 were acquitted for their actions, and Mary Kelly's actions are of the exact same nature. What she did was legal, moral and peaceful.

by Ray Wed Jan 29, 2003 16:19

'Freedom of speech' does not equal 'freedom from criticism'. You are free to state your opinion. Others are free to argue with that opinion. Before you start throwing these terms around you should learn the difference between 'accepting peoples points of view' and 'accepting the right of other people to hold and express different points of view'.
Or do you think 'freedom of speech' means your right to tell everyone what to think, and our right to accept your opinions without question?

by Conor - WSM (personal capacity) Wed Jan 29, 2003 16:31

Tony : The Shannon people were making their point well enough through the media without having to do this (third time actually).

Lets hope its not the last !

Its not the school debating team here Tony.
The POINT has already been made and taken.
68% of Irish people are against this unilateral war mongering by the US as indicated by the last MRBI/Irish Times poll.

The point NOW is not what do we feel
It's HOW do we stop it !
This is about the death of thousands of people if Bush decides some mad dictator has dotted the wrong eyes and tees in a 12,000 page dosier. This is UTTER MADNESS and you're whinging about vandalism boo hoo !
what planet are you from - if you saw Hitler in a Junkers 52 landing Shannon in 1940 what would you do? Ring your local TD! Have a cup of tea with the furher and try to convince him of the error of his ways!
Wouldn't want to lose that over whelming public support that you already have.........

Fair play to Mary indivdual courage has bought us forward
mass direct action can stop this re fueling !

Tony: Anyhow, I can see that the Indymedia fans dont accept other peoples points of view.

Its called political argument sun shine !!

Conor (WSM personal capacity)

by Isobel Thu Jan 30, 2003 00:39

You tell them Tony!
This is the rent a mob that dont actually give a shite about Iraqi children. Its just a good excuse to act the prat, have a bit of a lark blocking streets, insult the cops etc. It always used to be the lack of student grants that was the cause, have a sit down on O'Connell Bridge, get dragged off and shout 'brutality'!, now they jump on the Iraq bandwagon, sure its all great crack!! Funny that the mob never felt compelled to have a go at the Sinn Fein Offices with their axes and paint. I suppose that would ba attacking their pals.

by John Beecher - IWM Thu Jan 30, 2003 15:16 cav_man53 at hotmail dot com

What she did was pure vandleism pure and simple, which we the people of Ireland will have to pay for.The groips involved and Mary shoild pay for the damage. The plane in question is a C40 (737 Cargo plane for the uneducated) was based in Italy and does`nt have the range to fly to the Gulf. The majority could`nt care less if Shannon is being used by American Forces. Foynes was used to transport Generals through during WW2 and nobady said a word. No baody said a word during the Gulf War1 or is that different????????

by Harq al-Ada Fri Jan 31, 2003 11:25

Destruction of a war machine is NOT vandalism, it's an act of Peace. Vandalism is design, manufacture, and service of such atrocious artifacts. (Their *use* is not vandalism, its MURDER.)

Too bad the damn thing was not smashed to debris and burn to ashes.

May be it's time for citizens to just say ENOUGH! in this very way, making war imposible, busted death device by busted device. I would truly stop this imperialist wars.

by not a leftist - reality inc. Fri Jan 31, 2003 20:06

So are you idiots going to go out with hatchets and destroy every US and British aircraft headed to the gulf? One thing is for sure, you'll probably do more damage than the Iraqi air defense network will do. This psycho should be locked up for giving aid and comfort to the enemy.

by Frida Berrigan - War Resisters League Sat Feb 01, 2003 01:28 berrigaf at newschool dot edu

I am writing as the daughter of two American Plowshares activists- Elizabeth McAlister and Philip Berrigan- who have spent years in prison for disarming U.S. weapons of war.

Most recently my father (then in his late 70s) and three others were imprisoned for a year for disarming two A-10 Warthogs, planes used to bomb Iraq and former Yugoslavia with deadly and radioactive depleted uranium shells. http://www.plowsharesactions.org/webpages/PLOWSHARESVS.htm

My dad died in December, soon after blessing three Catholic nuns who disarmed a Minuteman missile silo in Colorado. They are in prison now, awaiting trial in late March and facing 30 years in prison on charges such as sabotage. http://www.nonviolence.org/nukeresister/131women.html

Since 1980, more than 70 affinity groups in the United States, Europe, Australia and New Zealand have disarmed U.S. weaponry in an effort to enact Isaiah's mandate that "they shall beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks, and nations shall not raise sword against nation any more." For more information, please visit www.plowsharesactions.org

On behalf of my family, and the community of plowshares activists, I would like to say thank you to Mary Kelly for her courageous disarmament action, and thank you to all the people protesting U.S. military aggression being launched from Irish soil. We stand with you, we support you, and we applaud you.

Peace,

Frida Berrigan

by US citizen and proud of Mary Sun Feb 02, 2003 06:07

The US, where i live, is estimating that starting a "war" with iraq could cost up to 100 billion dollars. I graduated from a 4 year public university and have a $30,000 student loan debt. With the money the US would spend on a war on iraq, my student loan could be paid in full 3,333,333 times. If you call what Mary did vandalism, then i call what the US government is about to do Grand Theft from the people of the US. Not to talk about how a preemptive strike against iraq is against international law and will only serve to push many already angry people over the edge. And not to mention the civil and human rights violations the US commits against its own people and the people of the world...and it's history of state-sponsored terrorism, propping up brutal dictators, and blatant disregard for international law.
everyone who thinks the US is some pillar of democracy and freedom should read a history book...start with "bury my heart at wounded knee" by dee brown and end with a book about the prison industrial complex here...maybe then you yourself will want to smash their war machines.

another world without war and hatred is possible...but not through the wrongly-motivated bombs of the US army or british army.

by skirda Sun Feb 02, 2003 19:58

Just wanted to add my support from the US.
Thank you Mary! I hope others around the world soon take similar actions. Direct Action all the way!

by Phuq Hedd Mon Feb 03, 2003 05:50

The guy who made those estimates (Lawrence Lindsey) was ousted from his job by the Bush administration because they wanted to low-ball the figure. See link. Many believe that US$200 billion is itself much lower than reasonable.