United Campaign against Plastic Bullets

by er... Thu Aug 29, 2002 14:01

given the violence against them, by both loyalists and nationalists, i think the PSNI should be allowed to use plastic baton rounds. the met is using them as well to avoid the use of live rounds. at least the PSNI is unlike the IDF, which seems to need to shoot 14 year kids in the head when they throw a stone. what do you propose be used in their place when the police are being bombarded by pipe/petrol bombs and the like?

by er... Thu Aug 29, 2002 14:23

all this technology, eh?

by robbie Thu Aug 29, 2002 16:40

Sure, given what's going on here PSNI need some form of riot control measure (funny how loyalists and republicans come together to blame the PSNI. What's the alternative? Just let both groups get laid into each other with all the casualties that would bring?)
However, some form of measure other than the plastic bullet needs to be found, on the basis that one death is too many, and a number of people have been killed by baton rounds over the years. I'd like to see water cannon used more widely - not perfect by any means (a bit lumbering for a start, expensive and difficult to move) but, ultimately it would provide an element of control without killing anyone. I think, given the reality of the situation here and the probability of sectarian rioting for the forseeable future, that everyone needs to be involved in the search for effective and realistic alternatives to plastic bullets.
Any ideas?

by michael Fri Aug 30, 2002 10:58

i guess you have bean bag guns, or foam and stuff that the americans seem to test but i don'y know how they would work in a frantic riot. maybe the batons rounds themselves need to have their design changed so they fragment on impact instead of slamming into someone at full force. i dunno, but i think it is important to distinguish between the baton rounds used in NI and plastic bullets, which are used in other places such as Israel. The former are large and a wide, the latter are just plastic coated bullets.

by chief superintendent colin craporn Fri Aug 30, 2002 23:45

why not just let the community representatives sort it out amongst each other, and stay out of working class areas, nobody wants yous, or likes yous, yous shot dead children with plastic bullets just to protect your big brave brit squaddie wankers who shouldnt have been in republican areas anyway, snooping, spying and arresting and raiding civillian homes. big brave blokes dont need plastic bullets, guns or any form of weapons to deal with children. yous beat up working class protestants and catholics, in your cells, just becos they were working class, yous protect the rich, judges, establishment and big buisness, thats all you are there for. your hired hands, just follow your orders, dont forget yous have an expensive recruitment and publicity campaign in the mainstream media, why do you need to try and recruit on indymedia.ie, desperate? just follow orders from your binky old boy superiors and stop working class people rioting near luxury apartments/waterfront hall and those plush new developments, wouldnt want them blown up would you. dont yous feel sick, after so many years slaving away, englishman colin crapporn gets the top peeler job.

by robbie Mon Sep 02, 2002 11:06

some articulate, reasoned debate - what world problem are you going to enlighten us on next.

by Angrier Activist Mon Sep 02, 2002 14:05

Hey Guys,

Think of what you are saying here; basically you are defending the right of cops to attack people.

What about reclaim the streets? Do you think the Gardai should be able to ust plkastic bullets, watercannon, beanbag guns etc on 22 September?

AA

by Robbie Tue Sep 03, 2002 10:10

I'm not defending the right of the cops to attack anyone. It's a fact of life at present that cops, especially in the north, are going to use 'riot control' measures, whether we like it or not (and I know that many people on this site are anti-cops which is fine if you're that way inclined).
Therefore, best to think about the realities of the situation. Plastic bullets/baton rounds have killed people so they shouldn't be used, but the problem isn't going to go away, whatever way you view the cops, so viable alternatives (which don't kill people) are required.
Hope reclaim the streets goes well on the 22nd.