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offsite link The Wholesome Photo of the Month Thu May 09, 2024 11:01 | Anti-Empire

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The Saker
A bird's eye view of the vineyard

offsite link Alternative Copy of thesaker.is site is available Thu May 25, 2023 14:38 | Ice-Saker-V6bKu3nz
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offsite link The Saker blog is now frozen Tue Feb 28, 2023 23:55 | The Saker
Dear friends As I have previously announced, we are now “freezing” the blog.  We are also making archives of the blog available for free download in various formats (see below). 

offsite link What do you make of the Russia and China Partnership? Tue Feb 28, 2023 16:26 | The Saker
by Mr. Allen for the Saker blog Over the last few years, we hear leaders from both Russia and China pronouncing that they have formed a relationship where there are

offsite link Moveable Feast Cafe 2023/02/27 ? Open Thread Mon Feb 27, 2023 19:00 | cafe-uploader
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Lockdown Skeptics

The Daily Sceptic

offsite link News Round-Up Thu Jul 18, 2024 00:35 | Richard Eldred
A summary of the most interesting stories in the past 24 hours that challenge the prevailing orthodoxy about the ?climate emergency?, public health ?crises? and the supposed moral defects of Western civilisation.
The post News Round-Up appeared first on The Daily Sceptic.

offsite link Too Few Care for the Beauty of Nature Wed Jul 17, 2024 20:18 | Joanna Gray
Ed Miliband?s decision to give the Mallard Pass a 3,000-acre-solar farm is like forcing a baby to have tattoos for its own health, says Joanna Gray. Trouble is, too few these days care for the beauty of nature.
The post Too Few Care for the Beauty of Nature appeared first on The Daily Sceptic.

offsite link Moderna-Vaccinated Deaths Up to 50% Higher Than Pfizer, Official Czech Data Show Wed Jul 17, 2024 18:13 | Dr Clare Craig
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The post Moderna-Vaccinated Deaths Up to 50% Higher Than Pfizer, Official Czech Data Show appeared first on The Daily Sceptic.

offsite link The ?Green Physician Toolkit? Reads Like a Parody Wed Jul 17, 2024 16:00 | In-house doctor
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The post The ‘Green Physician Toolkit’ Reads Like a Parody appeared first on The Daily Sceptic.

offsite link King?s Speech: Labour?s Legislative Programme at a Glance Wed Jul 17, 2024 13:30 | Will Jones
King Charles has unveiled Sir Keir Starmer's legislative programme for his Labour Government, complete with more race equality laws, more renters' rights and a trans-inclusive conversion therapy ban.
The post King’s Speech: Labour’s Legislative Programme at a Glance appeared first on The Daily Sceptic.

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Voltaire Network
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offsite link Netanyahu soon to appear before the US Congress? It will be decisive for the suc... Thu Jul 04, 2024 04:44 | en

offsite link Voltaire, International Newsletter N°93 Fri Jun 28, 2024 14:49 | en

offsite link Will Israel succeed in attacking Lebanon and pushing the United States to nuke I... Fri Jun 28, 2024 14:40 | en

offsite link Will Netanyahu launch tactical nuclear bombs (sic) against Hezbollah, with US su... Thu Jun 27, 2024 12:09 | en

offsite link Will Israel provoke a cataclysm?, by Thierry Meyssan Tue Jun 25, 2024 06:59 | en

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Marx And Morality

category international | anti-capitalism | opinion/analysis author Monday January 11, 2016 20:33author by Paddy Hackett Report this post to the editors

Morality based on materialist conditions

Society determines the character of culture.

Society determines the character of culture, consciousness and morality. Capitalism, then, determines the nature of morality. Consequently it provides the conditions that enable us to condemn the exploitation of labour power as morally wrong. If exploitation is morally wrong then there is a necessity to eliminate it and replace it with social conditions that are exploitation free. In this sense we can say that there is a materialist basis that justifies condemning exploitation and alienation as morally wrong.

author by Mike Novackpublication date Sat Jan 16, 2016 01:44author address author phone Report this post to the editors

To give a simple example (from what you said)

A is immoral (that given as true) is INSUFFICIENT all by itself to derive B is obligated to do something about A (assuming that B personally isn't doing A, etc.)

"A is immoral" is a statement.about fact, an "is" statement. "B should do something about that" is a "ought" sort of statement.

You need an "axiom" here, relating at "is" to the "ought". For example, you COULD have something like "If X is wrong, then even if personally innocent of X, ought to do something about it." Now I'm not going to argue for or against particular axioms of that sort, just going to point out that the moral philosophers of this world aren't in agreement. Lots of "schools" out there.

But you aren't going to get anywhere with pure materialism. All "is" statements". Even Marxist moral philosophy is going to need some "oughts". If this isn't making any sense to you, I suggest going back to Ethics 101. The necessary 'axiom" relating "is" to "ought" is NOT going to be a materialist statement.

.

author by Paddy Hackettpublication date Sun Jan 17, 2016 21:05author address author phone Report this post to the editors

Mike: But you aren't going to get anywhere with pure materialism. All "is" statements". Even Marxist moral philosophy is going to need some "oughts".

Paddy: It is not going to need “an ought” because the conditions for the elimination of a fact that is morally wrong already exist and are developed within capitalism as a social system. This means that objective conditions exist for the replacement of capitalism with communism. In a sense this is a socio-ontological matter.

Morality is just a form of condemnation –that capitalism is wrong. Once it's moral nature is established then the moral fact can be eliminated. The problem is a subjective one: the failure of the working class to develop this moral consciousness –class consciousness. The internal materialist or objective conditions already exist.

author by Mike Novackpublication date Tue Jan 19, 2016 19:47author address author phone Report this post to the editors

But really there may be no help for you but biting the bullet and taking a course of the Ethics 101 sort.

You think you can get from "X is bad" to a REASON why you should do anything about X just from the "X is bad"

WHY? WHY should something being bad be a REASON for you to do anything? Suppose instead we had a statement "X is blue". Does that give you a reason to do anything? Both are stating a factual condition. Neither sasy anything about your actions.

Now suppose you have a statement "If X is Z, you should eliminate X" Do you notice something about that statement, that it has BOTH and "is" and an ought"? That means if you have these statements:

1) If something is bad, you should work to eliminate it.
2) Capitalism is bad.

Conclusion: You should work to eliminate capitalism.

But while statement "2" above is a statement in the realm of factual statements, statement "1" was not. It states a relationship within the moral realm of discourse. It is NOT a "material" statement.

Could I make a suggestion. The left tradition did not come into existence with Marx, it pre-existed. And among the precursors were some who some in ethics. So why don't you look up "utilitarianism. Like I said elsewhere, I suspect you could base morality for Marxists with most schools. But historically, there was a relationship between the utilitarianism and the pre Marx left.

 
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