Galway Ad-Busters say; "the Referendum results are gas".

by A yes voter Tue Jun 15, 2004 00:02

This is why the no campaign lost.
They played the race card and fell over each other to call people who were considering voting yes racist.

Great debating skills

Joe public : I'm thinking of voting yes
No Campaign : We know better than you vote no you racist.
Joe Public : But what about...
No Campaing : Racist look at him he should be in the KKK
Joe Public : But....
No Campaign : Racist , racist, racist.
Joe Public : Screw you so.

by pc Tue Jun 15, 2004 00:12

not particualrily impressed by that either.. but some would say call a spade a spade

by until it sleeps Tue Jun 15, 2004 03:37

I'm sure that calling 80% of irish people racist ia a constructive strategy. Good luck on promoting popular leftism. hahahahaha!

by Gaillimhed Tue Jun 15, 2004 10:23

Im sure 79.2% of Galway city were delighted with being branded racists by you dickheads.
How fuckin dare you.
Not happy with driving up the yes Vote with yer muck-raking and shit-throwing, now you're going to blame everyone else.
Nice one, good luck getting support for your next pet project.
Havent you guys ever heard the term 'counterproductive'?

by Chunky monkey Tue Jun 15, 2004 13:00

Nobody called people who voted for this referendum racist. Not even CARR. The No camp made it very clear that the referendum itself was racist and would lead to increased racism in Ireland, which it has. As for the previous regressive trolls. Piss off back to your neo nazi websites no anti immigrant candidates got in nor will they ever the opponents of the referendum massively increased their vote. The past was yours but the future is ours.

by Joe Tue Jun 15, 2004 13:13

The (electoral) left with one or two exceptions ran away from the referendum for fear of losing votes. Now they are stupid enough to celebrate a couple of extra concil seats as a victory without realising the scale of the defeat that the referendum being passed 4:1 represents for anyone with any sort of progressive ideas.

In terms of the speech bubble I think its overstating the racist vote. The RTE exit poll shows that not everyone voted for racist reasons, 'only' 63% of the yes vote was racist. The other 37% citied the official reasons which may have been objectively racist but at least were not motivated by hatred of immigrants.

by historically minded iosaf Tue Jun 15, 2004 13:24

They have always been victims of prejudice instead, and worked hard to achieve their completely just and equitable postition on the scales of global justice, without redress to manipulation, exploitation or hiding under either British or US skirts.
It's the continental majority of Europeans who are racist, they're the ones who regularly elect racist politicians, propose racist laws, and at least twice a century spark international crises with fair dollops of pogrom, ethnic cleansing and so on.
Thankfully, Ireland has nothing to do with these people. And the UK eurosceptics with whom we enjoy the vast majority of our trade, will keep us safe for free from the nastyness "over there".

The glib politicians of Ireland, have achieved very little with the nationality referendum which could not have been achieved through other laws. And it has sent a clear signal to the ultra-right of Europe, who don't ever need to validate the increase in their popular support by going to the polls.

Well done FF/PD you presided well.
2004 will surely be historic.

by tom Tue Jun 15, 2004 14:18

By implying that racism is somehow a German phenomenom , the Black Pope' s speech bubble borders on being racist . Unintentionally I'm sure , but nearly all racism is unintentional /unconscious .
Does Owen care how German people feel when they see this Basil Fawlty sort of stuff on Galway's streets ?

by conor (wsm personal capacity) Tue Jun 15, 2004 15:04

Actually the "common sense" racism that had people rushing to the ballot boxes foaming at the mouth, tossing away the election ballot papers, telling an RTE exit poll that 37% felt there were too many immigrants in the"our" country is entirely a state/media driven phenomenon in this country

There are no major far right forces and those that do exist got another drubbing in the local elections. But hardly a day goes by without some official pronouncement on "welfare tourism" "bogus asylum seekers" “90% bogus” “Nigerian conmen” and so on.

The implications are that “these people” (non Irish, non EU) are lazy shirkers and slackers, that they have nothing to contribute, that they are, in one word, inferior to us hard working Irish sorts.

The implication is quite clearly racist or at least xenophobic. It has continued for 10 years and is now all-pervasive and it's driven from the very top.

Conor

by mr. puzzled Tue Jun 15, 2004 16:02

The funny thing is that this alleged "xenophobia" is most widespread among the ordinary folk, the "plain people of Ireland".

The would-be mini-Lenins and various other class warriors here who have been so quick to throw around the "racist" slur have conveniently overlooked the fact that the boss class in Ireland has little or no problem with the country being swamped with immigrants, it's all a convenient pool of compliant cheap labour for them - and let it be said that there aren't too many migrant labourers buying up real estate on Ailesbury Road or on the Dalkey seafront ..... (apart from maybe a few wealthy Russian mafiosi or Dutch drug barons or suchlike) .....

Likewise the "lunatic left" appears to have absolutely no problem with Ireland being transformed into some sort of bizarre multi-cultural melting pot (like much of western Europe, e.g. France Benelux, Germany (at least the western part), Austria, Italy and Spain etc.) and a sort of extended maternity wing for Sub-Saharan Africa.

[PS: Note to politically correct zealots - Sub-Saharan is a geographical term ... not a racially motivated one .....]

Strange bedfellows .... the bosses and the looney lefties ..... for once they are resonating together on the same wavelength though undoubtedly for different reasons ......

It is a great mystery to me .... I wonder can anyone explain it ....

by tom Tue Jun 15, 2004 17:17

The meaning of your first sentence is something of a puzzle. If the xenephobia is only alleged , how can it be widespread ? Or is it something to do with the inverted commas you put on the word "xenophobia" somehow negating the negative word "alleged" ? Try to formulate your thoughts more clearly in the future - it often helps .

by jeff Tue Jun 15, 2004 17:44

Well it is, and you guys are engaging in gross generalisations that would make Rush Limbaugh look as sweet and as honest as, erm...

well, there are no sweet honest peope in the world that are famous that I can think of.

Thing is, I reckon people voted yes because it all has to do with numbers, not race. just my opinion

by conor - wsm (personal capacity) Wed Jun 16, 2004 11:18

Funnily enough Mr Puzzled has absolutely put his finger on it in my view. There’s nothing inherently racist or xenophobic about the Irish boss class. What they need is cheap, insecure and preferably illegal labour.

The easiest way to ensure this is to cut back on any and all legal migration options and to promote a climate of fear, xenophobia and, ultimately, racism. The easiest way to do it is to pour the crap down from the top and after 10 years, unfortunately, people of all classes have bought hook, line and sinker.

I think you’ll also find that its not us “mini Lenins” that came out to an RTE exit poll and said we voted yes because there were too many immigrants in the country. That’s a little thing called the nature of reality!

OK forgive my egoism but here's a quote from an articel I did last year that sort of sums the bosses position well

"Right now according to the OECD by 2050 the ratio of working people to over 65s will be 2:1 to keep this ratio at its current level of around 4:1 Italy would need 2.2 million immigrants - Germany 3.4 million. In fact it looks like the capitalists are already well aware of this and wish to keep large numbers of "illegals" around as a cheap and easily exploitable labour source. The Financial Times of 23rd February 2000 went so far as to attribute to economic boom at the end of the 1990s to the "illicit angels of America's Economic miracle" specifically the 3- 12 million Mexican and South American "illegals" doing all the shitty jobs. "Immigration Yes welfare No" is the unspoken watchword of Wall Street.

There's a lesson here for workers in the host countries as well. If they feel their wages are being devalued by immigrants it is surely in their interests firstly to argue for full union membership and to fight for equal terms and conditions but secondly to smash border controls and end the situation where people can be made "illegal" and subjected to sweatshop conditions.."

by anon Wed Jun 16, 2004 13:42

Is conor of wsm the only one of you talking sense here?-he is right.

by Joe Wed Jun 16, 2004 13:58

I intended to write something detailed in advance of the referendum about how it was part of keeping a pool of 'illegal' labour for capitalism to use. I never got around to the writing but I have put an index of useful articles that look at this relationship up at http://struggle.ws/racism/labour.html

by iosaf Wed Jun 16, 2004 17:04

The national consultative human rights Commission CNCDH, publishes it's report on the rise of Xenophobia and Racism and particularly the role being played by the internet in this.

Today and tomorrow they are meeting with the European security and co-operation organisation to plan something on this widespread problem of xenophobia, anti-semitism and racism, which is arguably at its worst at present in France.

I reported yesterday on the media updates how the Isreali rightwing daily had described new efforts to coax Israeli migrants from France in terms reminescent of Operation Solomon which saw Ethopians being air-lifted.
http://www.lemonde.fr/web/article/0,1-0@2-3226,36-369192,0.html

by Phuq Hedd Wed Jun 16, 2004 22:42

You can't be racist unless you wear a pointy white hood and believe that the "coloureds"are subhuman.

Any other beliefs and actions which don't fit into this simple historical mould are non-racist even if they result in the denial of citizenship to children born in the country because their parents are "not Irish".

Welcome to the future of cheap labour all of you who voted against making it impossible for people to live and work in security.

by gerry k Wed Jul 07, 2004 14:27

why can't old "new leftists" see that liberal immigration is a agenda of neo-conservativism( along with social liberalism and neo-liberal economics).
If you really cared about working class people you'd support protectionism i.e. strict controls.
If these controls are wrong, or conterproductive, then there's no hope 4 anyone except greater social division.