OscailtOur future under a ratified Lisbon Treaty – II."Democracy means having the choice. Dictatorship means being given the choice." (Jeannine Luczak)
Breaking news: Italian MP, Sgarbi denounces the Statistical Fraud on COVID-19. The speech of the Member of Parliament Vittorio Sgarbi in the session of the Italian Camera, Meeting no. 331 of Friday 24, April, 2020. Vittorio Sgarbi, denounces the closure of 60% of the businesses for 25,000 COVID-19 Deaths, of which the National Institute of Health says 96.3% died NOT of COVID-19 but of other pathologies. That means only 925 have died of the virus. 24,075 have died of other things.2008-05-26T11:30:02+00:00Indymedia Irelandimc-ireland@lists.indymedia.iehttp://www.indymedia.ie/atomfullposts?story_id=87712http://www.indymedia.ie/graphics/feedlogo.gifFair and balancedhttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/87712#comment2289352008-05-26T11:30:02+00:00AidanI see your article is fair and balanced...
Lisbon Treaty: The Facts and the Myt...I see your article is fair and balanced...<br />
<br />
Lisbon Treaty: The Facts and the Myths <br />
<br />
What we need to know to make our own decision. There are too many baseless and biased arguments coming from both sides on this. This post gives an overview of what will actually change, and addresses some of the myths that some groups are suggesting.<br />
<br />
FACTS:<br />
<br />
*European Parliament<br />
The Treaty will cap the number of MEPs at 750. States will be<br />
guaranteed a minimum of 6 seats and a maximum of 96. Under these new<br />
rules and the current make up of the EU Ireland will lose 1 MEP bringing<br />
our number of MEPs to 12.<br />
<br />
*EU Commission<br />
The size of commission (currently 27) will be reduced from 2014. Every<br />
state will have equal rights to appoint a commissioner. This will mean<br />
that Ireland will have an appointee on the commission every 10 years out<br />
of 15, as will all other EU members.<br />
<br />
*President of the EU Council<br />
Currently the presidency of the Council of Ministers rotates among<br />
member states every 6 months. A full time president of the council will<br />
be elected by member state governments for a maximum of five years. The<br />
hosting of the EU Council will be carried out by a trio of member states<br />
for a period of 18 months.<br />
<br />
*High Commissioner for Foreign Affairs<br />
The EU currently has two main external representatives; the Council's<br />
High Representative for Common Foreign and Security Policy and the<br />
Commissioner for External Affairs. These two positions will be merged<br />
creating a single position of High Representative for Foreign Affairs<br />
and Security Policy. The office holder will become Vice President of the<br />
Commission and will chair the Foreign Affairs Council of Ministers. This<br />
persons role will be to co-ordinate the external activities of the EU.<br />
<br />
*Move from Veto to Majority Voting<br />
A number of areas are being moved from being veto issues at the European<br />
Council to being governed by a qualifying majority. In a number of<br />
these areas Ireland can also choose to opt out<br />
<br />
*New Double Majority System<br />
The Treaty also changes how qualified majority voting works; if the<br />
Treaty is passed, double majority voting will come into force in 2014.<br />
This means that for proposed legislation to be approved by the Council,<br />
the support of 55% of the Member States will be required, and in<br />
addition they must comprise 65% of the Union's population. This is<br />
supposed to ensure that no bloc (either the small member states or the<br />
large ones) can gang up on another.<br />
<br />
*New Role for National Parliaments<br />
When new legislation is proposed national parliaments can consider<br />
whether this new legislation is an area that should be governed by the<br />
EU or whether it should be decided locally under the principle of<br />
subsidiarity. National parliaments will have an eight-week period to<br />
offer a reasoned opinion on whether a Commission proposal is breeching<br />
subsidiarity. If at least one third of the votes of national parliaments<br />
request it, the proposal must be reviewed.<br />
If a Commission proposal for EU legislation is opposed by more than half<br />
of the votes allocated to national parliaments (which is one per chamber<br />
in a bicameral system and two per chamber in a unicameral system), the<br />
Commission must justify its proposal in a reasoned opinion and it may be<br />
blocked by the Council of Ministers or the European Parliament.<br />
<br />
*Justice & Home Affairs- Irish Opt out<br />
Justice and Home Affairs has been changed from being a veto area to a<br />
qualified majority area. The areas affected include terrorism, human<br />
trafficking, drug trafficking, corruption, money laundering,<br />
counterfeiting, computer crime and organised crime. Ireland has chosen<br />
to opt out of these provisions, along with the UK, but with an option to<br />
opt in on a case-by-case basis. These arrangements are to be reviewed<br />
within three years of the Treaty entering into force.<br />
<br />
*Charter of Fundamental Rights<br />
The Lisbon Treaty states that the Union is founded on the values of<br />
respect for human dignity, freedom, democracy, equality, the rule of law<br />
and respect for human rights of persons belonging to minorities. The<br />
Treaty will also make the Charter of Fundamental Rights legally binding<br />
for the first time. The Charter consolidates and reflects the human<br />
rights which are already set down in European and Irish law.<br />
<br />
*Citizens' Initiative<br />
If 1 million signatures are collected across the EU on a particular<br />
issue, the Commission have to consider it and issue a response. Such an<br />
initiative however does not bind the commission to take further action<br />
on the issue in question.<br />
<br />
*Leaving the EU<br />
One of the things that the Lisbon Treaty does is<br />
that it provides a clear mechanism for a memberstate to leave the EU for<br />
the first time. So if we do get the disaster scenario that some of the<br />
opponents paint; ie children conscripted to fight in Russian, a single<br />
50% EU corporation tax rate, Brussel's owned nuclear power stations at<br />
Tara, forced abortions for all etc etc we can always just leave.<br />
<br />
MYTHS<br />
<br />
"This will be the last EU referendum"<br />
<br />
Certain groups are arguing the Art 48 of the Treaty makes the Treaty<br />
self amending and that this means that the Irish people will never again<br />
have a chance to vote on an EU treaty.<br />
<br />
This is false. The Treaty is not self-amending and can only be amended<br />
in accordance with the constitutional requirements of each member state.<br />
Changes within the Treaty to allow the EU to acquire any new competences<br />
must be ratified by each member state in accordance with their own<br />
Constitutional requirements. Ireland must hold a referendum. Proposals<br />
to amend the Treaties require unanimous approval by the European Council<br />
and must be ratified in Ireland through a referendum or Oireachtas<br />
approval. Moving an area from unanimity to QMV requires the simplified<br />
revision procedure. Article 1.56 of the Treaty clearly states that any<br />
national government or any national Parliament may veto any proposal by<br />
the European Council. This provides an effective double lock because<br />
complete and unanimous approval of governments and Parliaments is<br />
needed. Military and defense decisions cannot be moved from unanimity<br />
to QMV by the Simplified Revision Procedure.<br />
<br />
"The Lisbon Treaty means that the EU can set Ireland' corporation tax rates"<br />
<br />
Opponents of the Treaty have made various claims regarding Irish<br />
corporation tax, including that the commission or the ECJ could force<br />
Ireland to change its corporation tax rates or that we could be forced<br />
to adopt a new common corporation tax base system<br />
<br />
These are both false. Corporation tax is unchanged by the treaty. Any<br />
move towards a common corporation tax base would require unanimous<br />
support; Ireland, the UK and Slovenia strongly oppose any such move.<br />
The EU Commission originally approved Ireland's lower 12.5% tax rate in<br />
the 1990s. Recent ECJ rulings confirm that the court will not interfere<br />
in member states' corporation tax rate.<br />
<br />
>The Lisbon Treaty will force Ireland to change its abortion laws<br />
Yeah this one comes out at every EU treaty. This time treaty opponents<br />
are linking it to the Charter of Fundamental Rights<br />
<br />
This is false. The Maastricht Protocal secured in the 1990s means that<br />
no EU treaty or future treaty can impact Ireland's constitutional<br />
provisions on abortion. Abortion law is governed separately by member<br />
states.<br />
<br />
"The Lisbon Treaty gives EU law supremacy over Irish law for the first time"<br />
<br />
Lisbon opponents are pointing to provisions of the Treaty (in particular<br />
the change to the Irish constitution which will enable the ratification<br />
of the Lisbon Treaty) which state that it overrules Irish law.<br />
<br />
This has been a feature of all previous EU treaties. Certain aspects of<br />
EU law have had supremacy over Irish law for decades. The Lisbon Treaty<br />
doesn't change this.<br />
<br />
"The Lisbon Treaty marks the end of Irish Neutrality"<br />
<br />
Treaty opponents have argued that Ireland will no longer be a neutral<br />
country, that we will be forced to spend more money on defense and that<br />
we will be obliged to defend other EU states if they are attacked.<br />
<br />
This is one that is also rolled out at every EU treaty. The EU does<br />
have a defensive infrastructure, that is why Irish troops are going to<br />
Chad as part of an EU battlegroup. This though is taking part under a<br />
UN mandate. Under article 28a of the treaty, the common defence policy<br />
is made subject to the individual defence policies of member states. In<br />
the case of Ireland, this means our position of military neutrality is<br />
not affected. We retain the right to veto any proposed defence or<br />
military action. This applies for example to the launch of any crisis<br />
management mission. Ireland can also opt-out of any activity that it<br />
does not want to be a part of. Irish defence policy is governed by the<br />
'Triple Lock'. Irish troops can not be deployed abroad unless the<br />
Government and the Oireachtas agree and there is a UN mandate for the<br />
mission. Ireland cannot join any common defence arrangement without a<br />
separate referendum of the Irish people. This position is explicitly<br />
stated in the proposed amendment to the constitution. If we ratify the<br />
treaty we will be writing neutrality into the Irish constitution.<br />
Article 28a paragraph 7 of the Treaty refers to the Solidarity Clause<br />
which clearly means that neutral states like Ireland cannot be forced to<br />
take part in a military comment against their will, even if another<br />
member state is attacked.<br />
<br />
Furthermore the Reform Treaty does not require Ireland to increase its<br />
military spending. The Treaty states that "Member States shall<br />
undertake progressively to improve their military capabilities". There<br />
are no specific commitments as to levels of expenditure nor is there any<br />
scope for these to be imposed. In the EU context, the improvement of<br />
such capabilities is in order to provide the Union with the capacity to<br />
carry out widely-supported crisis management tasks.The PASSERELLE clause.http://www.indymedia.ie/article/87712#comment2289652008-05-26T19:27:09+00:00paul cadierThe author of this analysis of the Traety of Lisbon, makes no mention of the so-...The author of this analysis of the Traety of Lisbon, makes no mention of the so-called "passserelle clause" (gang plank in English).<br />
It appeared in the original constitutional treaty rejected here in France and has re-emerged in the text of Lisbon. Simply put ,a unanimous vote in the council of ministers can at any time transfer a competance currently administered by nation-states up to the European level. Naturally, an Irish Minister could veto any attempt to move say defence, corporation tax, or abortion policy up to Brussels. His personal views may not however always concur with the majority of his electorate . There are no adequate measures that can be exerted upon a single man to respect the wishes of the majority of his electors. In France for example our President Sarkozy has made commitments to us and done the opposite in the confines of the Council of Ministers. His popularity has sunk to unprecedented depths but he cannot be removed until the next presidential election in 5 years. He is free to sell us short in Europe for all of that time. An adequate treaty would take human nature into account. This one however is just another twist of the ratchet, a one-way street leading to more centralisation.Cheershttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/87712#comment2290252008-05-27T15:59:29+00:00Gavin
Thanks Aidan felt that post was well worth the read, clear and to the point...I...<br />
Thanks Aidan felt that post was well worth the read, clear and to the point...I would be interested in hearing counter arguments to it as its out of my league in relation to what I know on the treaty.<br />
Military spendinghttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/87712#comment2292752008-05-30T14:41:36+00:00ConfusedFrom Aidan:
"Furthermore the Reform Treaty does not require Ireland to increase...From Aidan:<br />
<br />
"Furthermore the Reform Treaty does not require Ireland to increase its military spending. The Treaty states that "Member States shall undertake progressively to improve their military capabilities". There are no specific commitments as to levels of expenditure nor is there any scope for these to be imposed."<br />
<br />
How exactly do you improve your military capabilities without increasing your military spending? It's all clear nowhttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/87712#comment2293072008-05-30T18:48:17+00:00Not confused anymoreWas just going through the Irish Times archives and it appears the bould Willie ...Was just going through the Irish Times archives and it appears the bould Willie O'Dea has addressed my concerns on this issue:<br />
<br />
Tuesday, May 27, 2008:<br />
"Asked about the commitment for EU states to increase their military capabilities, Mr O'Dea said this meant spending money more smartly rather than spending more money."<br />
<br />
Is this an admission that govt defence spending has been less than smart up to now? What have they been buying - muskets, knuckle dusters?smart defencehttp://www.indymedia.ie/article/87712#comment2293322008-05-31T07:13:58+00:00shot in the foot"What have they been buying - muskets, knuckle dusters?" Yup, and lots of extra ..."What have they been buying - muskets, knuckle dusters?" Yup, and lots of extra fencing wire for Shannon Airport.