Women and the Irish Revolution

by britney spears - (the prince of coolavin) Thu Mar 30, 2006 20:30

Tell me, as you work as many others to educate (& are doing a good job of it) the general Irish public and yet more in other places far away to the meaning of the .:. republic, has it not occured to you, to refer to Eva Gore Booth by her name?

Why do you still use the classist title afforded her by marriage to a polish landowner?

Think about it.

by count of tyrone Thu Mar 30, 2006 20:56

Does it serve the "equality" of any republic to recognise titles? Of course it doesn't. Both the constitution of Saorstat Eirinn and the 1937 bunreacht of De Valera included articles which refused the recognition of titles. Something which has served us well.
Oh I remember as young lad, being told by a scion of an ancient family, (& a sticky to boot) that if there was anything at all going for the Eire state, it was quite simply the lack of an official state award system.= No gongs. Of course there are many who have attempted to use them to further their social climbing and business ventures. the "baron de brefney", those who attempted to buy lord of the manor titles (unconstiutionally) in the mid 60s to the present day, yet somehow the tug the forelock sentimentality for noble titles didn't seem to go away. In any other system, in any other state in Europe we would today ponder the wisdom of a "lord gay" or "Gay byrne of montrose papal knight" warning us all about the "dhrink driving". Thank our lucky stars we aren't. Remember our feelings on "Sir Bob Geldof". But at end, the Irish state though happy through Gay Byrne to see "lord" mountcharles of Slane on the late late show once a year, didn't (Despite the finest efforts of the other petulant ogras of fine gael) produce an honour system. And of our finest sons and daughters, I'd like to think they actually declined honours offered them by other states.
The closest thing we got in Eire were arguably the aosdana chairmanship of Samuel Beckett, the sprinking of "knighthood of saint gregory" awards to devout kathurlicks of very murkey influence, and of course the ansbacher account holders.- I am reminded of the court case to stop the repulsive author of the mid 80s "irish 1000" (of the tattler infamy- name escapes me) using the harp as the cover image. She admitted to squeezing in anyone with a title, not because of influence but for "elan". think about that. "e-l-a-n".
I really find the snobbery inherent in all this utterly revolting. And one way to counter it is quite honestly to take the countess out of eva gore booth's name. Honour her as the woman she was not as a wife . And then take the "the" out of rahilly's name. And thus be consistent for not one of you calls the earl of tyrone "the earl" is the o'neill. Or else accept Lord Paisley of the Shankill and do your damnest do get Lord Adams of the Falls up there too.

sin é.
I have Eva Gore Booth on my side.
rename that piscine!

by pat c Fri Mar 31, 2006 11:44

I tnink you are mixing Eva up with her sister Constance (the countess). Eva, afaiaa, never became a countess. If you dont like polish names or titles then you may refer to Constance Gore-Booth.

by des traynor Fri Mar 31, 2006 21:45

Yes that's right. No honours system. Just the bagman and the brown paper envelope. A pragmatic people indeed, nothing fancy.

by Ann Unmanageable Fri Apr 07, 2006 04:16

'They are at once the boldest and the most unmanageable of revolutionaries.'
Eamon de Valera

by C M Guerin Sat Apr 08, 2006 00:50

The reason the woman in question is known as Constance Markievcz or Countess Markievicz is that she herself referred to herself in that way. I really see no reason to impose our values on historical figures.

by c murray - TaraWatch Sun Apr 09, 2006 21:27 dotliath at gmail dot com n/a 087-7765289

"The light of evening, Lissadell
Great windows opened to the south,
two girls in silk kimonos, both
Beautiful, one a gazelle.
But a raving autumn shears
blossom from the summer's wreath
the older is condemned to death,
pardoned, drags out lonely years
conspiring among the ignorant.'
WB Yeats. (October 1927)

Con gave her daughter into the care of family, she was imprisoned
in England without trial. She was the only woman sentenced to death as a result of 1916.
She worked tirelessly as an activist and revolutionary against much personal privation.
She died shattered and broken by what she witnessed in the prisons.
Today her personal items were auctioned in Dublin.
Honour the woman who was a brave soldier and generous of heart.

by Michelle Clarke - Social Justice and Ethics Mon Apr 10, 2006 23:23

Astounded I watched a programme about the 1960 Commemoration 'in the reign ' of Eamon DeValera, and learnt that only two women, one Kathleen Clarke, the widow of Thomas Clarke who was executed in 1916 for his part in the Rising and alas I fail to remember the name of the other woman.

Shame on him. Women played a vital role in the Movement and women went to prison just as men did and were condemned to appalling conditions.

I recall one woman, Estella Solomon, Artist, that we scarely hear of who lived on Waterloo Road who inter alia concealed guns in her parents garden, unknown to them. She was Jewish but she was an ardent supporter of the Nationalist cause in Ireland. She painted in an art gallery and it is thought she painted many men on the run and subsequently had to destroy such evidence. She later married to artist Sean Keating.....

Then we have Dr. Kathleen Lynn.....her contributions both at the time of the Troubles and the newly formed republic are nothing short of astounding.

I asked someone I thought would know a little more about these women the question today 'How do I find out about Cumann na mBan and did he know how many were sent to jail.....ironically, his grand-aunt had been, as had mine (and I only found out today by pure default)....He thought there were as many as 80 women sent to Kilmainham. Has anyone further information on this. He also said that there was photograph in Irish Times of the women who went to prison at that time and that the quality was particularly good. The names however were not given.

We never hear about the part played by the Mater Hospital and in particular the nurses.

Will people move away from the shame attached to history and wear the Easter Lilies this Easter? I must admit I do like to see people wearing the poppy to celebrate the war dead.....The sentiment for me is the same about the Easter Lily.....

George Santayana ' Those who forget history are condemned to repeat it'

Michelle Clarke

by Ann Unmanageable Tue Apr 11, 2006 01:28

Commanding Officer at City Hall garrison in 1916 and also the founder of St Ultan's, the first infant hospital in Dublin. She chose a profession at a time when many prejudices existed against female doctors. In 1899 she received her medical degree from the Royal University and obtained a post-graduate degree in the US. She was the first female resident at the Victoria Eye and Ear Hospital in Dublin.

In 1904 she became a GP practising from 9 Belgrave Road, Rathmines. She supported the Lock Out of 1913 and as a result joined the Irish Citizen Army. In the 1916 Rising she was Chief Medical Officer in the City Hall garrison, but when the Officer Commanding was shot, she, as next highest-ranking officer, took over the garrison.

She was elected to the Sinn Féin Executive in 1917. Active in the War of Independence, she was arrested in 1918 but was released to assist with the Flu Epedemic.
In 1919 she established St Ultan’s Hospital with the help of her friend Madeleine ffrench Mullen. At the outset, only women staffed the hospital. Kathleen pioneered the use of the BCG vaccination over ten years before it was in general use in Ireland. She promoted the work of Maria Montessori who visited St Ultan’s in 1934, and established a Montessori ward in the hospital.
Elected to the Dáil, but having opposed the Treaty of 1921, she did not take her seat. By 1926 she distanced herself from politics and concentrated on her hospital. She remained as a member of Rathmines Urban District Council until 1930.

Always a humanitarian, she was Vice President of Save the German Children, an organisation which located homes for German children in Ireland during the Second World War.

She continued to work as a doctor until she was over eighty.

More info of umanageable women@

by dunk Tue Apr 11, 2006 11:46

pity there wasnt a bit more details about the @1916 women and their actions in the past,
didnt stay too long for the questions and answers, perhaps that threw open a bit more in this area

anway, good to hear the bit that was new

by Michelle Clarke - Social Justice and Ethics Tue Apr 11, 2006 20:48

Tonight the RTE news gave a brief outline of Dr. Kathleen Lynn. Her home, an old deserted mansion in Connemara is now attracting attention from Developers. A local woman called Florence Clarke who is interested in history is trying to get a preservation order and preserve for history the former home of Dr. Kathleen Lynn.

Support ought to be given. This is the home of a woman who was both active at the time of the 1916 rising but likely contributed to medicine particularly in the distribution of the BCG vaccine and was responsible for the establishment of St. Ultan's Hospital. She is another dynamic force of that period.

I mentioned that while De Valera was on the run, he was accompanied by his dedicated secretary. I had forgotten her name.....

Kathleen O'Connell was his secretary. This must be an interesting history from a totally different perspective. Has anyone access to information on Kathleen O'Connell.......

Again, I ask the question. Are there names and records of the women who were sent to Mountjoy prison at the time of the Rising and during the Civil War. They were stoic and yet never received the acknowledgement that was their right.....

Michelle

Quotation:

'Political language is designed to make lies sound truthful and murder respectable, and to give an appearance of solidity to pure wind
George Orwell'