End the Occupation March

by ipsiphi Sat Sep 27, 2003 20:36

Barcelona was _different_ it is a year since the same coalition protested against the occupation of Palestine and then transformed itself into Stop the War on Iraq.

12,000 according to some, 6,000 according to Police. [I estimated 8,000 - 9,000.](I think generally find the middle point between trade union figures and police figures)

Pouring rain. Depressed attitude. Anarchists prominent, that means many people happy to walk between the flags and many new flags in view. Greens and ERC less prominent meaning they left their big helium balloons at home.

_No_ muslim blocks.
_No_ sustained singing/chanting.
_No_ anarchist street theatre groups.
_No_ popular entertainment.
More Spanish Republican flags than ever before.
Many Veterans of the Civil War.
_no_ argentinian/Brazilian/tibetan/african flags.

The impression some of us had (of all blocks) was that this was very much a "rôle call" day. We were very aware of a more marked plain clothes police surveillance supported by close almost instrusive helicopter surveillance.

initialreport:http://barcelona.indymedia.org/newswire/display/54594/index.php

There were also demonstrations today in:
Algeria, Australia, Austria, Bahrain, Belgium, Canada, Cyprus, Denmark, Egypt, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, India, Iran, Iraq, Ireland, Japan, Jordan, Lebanon, Macedonia, Mexico, Morocco, Netherlands, Norway, Pakistan, Palestine, Poland, Portugal, South Africa, South Korea, Spain, Sudan, Syria, Thailand, UAE, UK and USA.

Overall estimates will be out by Monday.

by Marchin marchin marchin Sat Sep 27, 2003 20:37

To paraphrase Dunphy, it was a good march but not a great one.

It was important to have some kind of get together for the movement but it was always going to be a bit dispiriting when the war isn't a hot enough issue to attract the tens of thousands at the moment.

Agree about the masked up people... I can see why some people do it at something like RTS but on a march like today its just acting the prick and is needlessly intimidating.

by jh Sat Sep 27, 2003 20:43

people could get used to groups masked up and not immediatley associate it with violence(violence that the cops usually start) the group went on to top oil but i thought it was an extremely suceesful act by just to get people used to it. its only threatening if people fear them and they didn't give any reason for any of them to fear them

by paul cummins Sat Sep 27, 2003 21:27

A protest _against the American occupation of Iraq has taken place in Parnell Square in Dublin. According to Gardaí, 12,000 people took part in the demonstration.

I was there to protest against Ireland's government involvement in the war that what im most ashamed of

12,000 really?

by ha ha Sat Sep 27, 2003 21:35

they said 1,200 (ie 12hundred) not 12,000

by pc Sat Sep 27, 2003 21:57

September 27, 2003

(17:08) A protest against the American occupation of Iraq has taken place in Parnell Square in Dublin. According to Gardaí, 12,000 people took part in the demonstration.


^^ look just copied and pasted that from rte website must be a typo :) thats what i was pointing out i was at it

by this Kasa proposes (iosaf he's reliable isn't he?) Sat Sep 27, 2003 22:55

if the State News Provider says 12,000 attended the march in Dublin, and Indymedia says 1,200 attended the march in Dublin, and the Gardaí say 4,000 attended the march in Dublin and the anarchists say 2,000 attended the march and the SWM say roughly 0.4% of their listed members attended the march in Dublin, and the SP say every resident in Fingal attended the march, and the Irish Times say 1,500 attended the march.

¿How many attended the march?

we may use soft mathematics:
RTE = "a"
Indymedia = "ie"
Gardaí = "G"
Anarchists = "@"
SWM = "SWM"
SP = "SP"
and the Irish Times = "X"
so we find the true attendance by checking the "official record": (a-G)2 x (ie-X) = how many attended the demo.
Using soft mathematics in this way, we come to the conclusion that fifteen years hence, doctoral thesis shall plum for 12,000 attended the march, and certain sensible shoe type historians shall say "500 masked and intimidating youths seized the oil supply links of Ireland".
and didn't give them back till either a friendly and popular Parish Priest came and talked to them, (or...) the British Army came to cups of tea.

meanwhile:
€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€
in Belgium the redkitten collective [ The Right Honorable "redkitten" and his english speaking pals] have suggested only 2,000 people attended the Brussels concentration.
http://www.redkitten.be/
they called their "Stop the Occupation of Palestine and Iraq on September 11, because there was nothing better to do"
http://belgium.indymedia.org/news/2003/09/73015.php

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
New York City is going to do it tomorrow, CNN forecast have foresighted 3,000,000 people marching through Manhatten, but activists there think it will be a dissappointment with only about 2,000.
if U R in NYC call 212-633-6646.
if U R not in the USA call 00-1-212-633-6646
tommorow join the other 3million or 2 thousand people @Columbus Circle at 1pm and for a mass march down Broadway, toward Times Square.

€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€€

Meanwhile in Austria everyone was reported by TV to gone out on the street and protested against the War, but indymedia thought only six people one carrying a heacy video recorded had arrived,
three of these wore masks for at least half of the time.
http://at.indymedia.org/front.php3?article_id=30655&group=webcast

They thought this was so historic that they made a digital movie of 5487kb and 3.20 minutes.
You can see these six people pretending to me much much more @ http://kanalb.de/spezial-austria2003/20030926-schwarz.ram

&&&&&&&& more anon....

by iosaf Sat Sep 27, 2003 22:57

Global round up of all the under estimates?
better than the Belgian over estimates last time!
[sorry ;-) ]

by Justin Morahan - Peace People Sun Sep 28, 2003 11:41

For me there were three highlights: Mary Kelly's sincere and stirring speech delivered in absentia by Paul O'Toole, Paul O'Toole's own song from his Anti-War CD, and the handing in of Commdt Ed Horgan's medals at the Dáil by that courageous man - in protest at the ending of our neutrality by a Dáil vote that allowed George W. Bush to use Shannon airport for war purposes.
As a pacifist who doesn't believe in armies, I have a particular admiration for Ed'd action as he is someone who has served in the Irish Army happily for many years and medals did mean an awful lot to him. Well done, again, Ed.
Any chance that someone could reproduce the texts of all 3 events here as comments?

by that Kasa Sun Sep 28, 2003 13:09

if not as comments then as articles?
and then conversations.
Try at first to talk to trusted loved ones, work your way up to strangers slowly.
Then some day you too, yes you out there at your PC will be able to go out your door, walk up to the door, knock on it, push it, and say what ever you want to.
Knock Knock!
Who's there?

by aunty Joe Sun Sep 28, 2003 13:15

I think that the IAWM only has itself to blame for the poor attendance at the march. The whole campain was(is) uncordonated in the extreme, as it was(is) tainted by party-petty politics. This is not an anti-war movment but an oppertunist intrusion into working peoples lives.

by IMC reader Mon Sep 29, 2003 12:21

It'd be a serious mistake to believe that this is an accident. People who have been around for a while know that this is a deliberate strategy by the SWP: build an ineffective front, get people to march in circles and listen to politicians' speeches, prevent any form of meaningful or effective action, make people feel completely impotent and demoralised, recruit enough people to be able to do the same with the next issue.
Activists in the Uk have long believed that the SWP has very strange connections and motivations...and if you think I am sectarian, then, you must explain their attack on direct action on the capitalist media (funny how the SWP is always welcome by the corporate press, isn't it?), their cynical attempts to divide the movement (remember Shannon), their complete failure to do anything useful (except paper selling and recruitment) in any campaign they have got themselves involved with, etc.
One day someone will write the infamous history of the dodgiest sect the Irish left has ever known. Hiostory won't forgive them.

by Jenny Mon Sep 29, 2003 14:23

Everything you said about Shannon , dividing the Campaign, the media, condemning direct action, could also be said of the SP. They also have weird connections. Look at the fiasco in the Ukraine and Russia. Read the articles by Denis Tourish and Marc Mulholland. Read John Thrones stuff.

by TIM Thu Oct 02, 2003 15:58

To JH:
The cops useally start? Wrong! They are gaurdians of the peace i.e their name in irish.... just for that i hope you are stabed by some violent scumbag that waited till there were no gardaí around!

To Justin M:
Really... is that your opinion, cause i can tell his mentallity, its these medals wont sell for anything so ill use them in an effort to steal the spotlight and make some money!

by Justin Morahan - Peace People Tue Apr 27, 2004 11:54

Would you not call that a scurrilous comment TIM, re Ed's motives.
If you don't know the man, you should get to know him. He's an honourable man,not like you suggest