USI attacks Government decision to slash childcare

by Conor - UCDSA / CFE Thu Aug 07, 2003 15:33 Conor at ziplip dot com

With all that the heroic USI did last year

1)Nothing much for ages.

2)Organising protests with the help of cops.

3)pulling out of any direct action.

4)Having nice meetings in their boardroom, discussing the mood of the students.

5)furthering their carreer options.

6)having cups of tea with minister monkeyface.

7)writing anti-cfe patronising bullshit in their glossy ad-mag.

its a wonder colm jordan- 1 man student movement, and fantasmic band of clever,competent boys and girls , cant achieve these here laid out goals on their own?

oh, i forgot, colm has gone, and with him, that sense of radicalism that surrounded usi last year!

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will will priestly try to get usi to leave usi?

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http://library.nothingness.org/articles/SI/en/display/4 - always relavant, like certain 80s house/pop bands, great stuff under the dated synths....
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by Gaz - indie lib. socialist Thu Aug 07, 2003 15:37

wow a press release...im sure dempseys shaking in his boots.

by SJMK - Popular front against Priestley (PFAP) Thu Aug 07, 2003 15:41

"Will Preistley, President, USI said: "This is a thinly veiled Government attack on initiatives designed to assist those who need assistance the most."

Will's latest propaganda stunt - so your going to lobby the minister now will? Well will why dont raise the idea of a silent protest just like you did in TCD to complain to minister dempsey about fees?

It's rich that Priestley is now speaking for disadvantaged and early school leavers as he remained very quiet over the disgraceful amount of reserved places in his college for those from disadvantaged backgrounds, numbering no more than seventy two I believe, and the funding crisis for the Trinity Access Programme (TAP) which deals with early school leavers and those whose social and educational background prevent them from going to college by giving them an alternative route.

Priestley's personality is no better than his politics he is arrogant beyond belief and when talking to a large grouping cannont look someone in the eye - btw this not shyness but arrogance on his part as he truely loves the sound of his voice.

by Noel Hogan. Thu Aug 07, 2003 15:54

1)Nothing much for ages.
The fact that USI were so in previous years had nothing to do with me, or most of last year's officerboard. That's like blaming this year's UCDSU exec for last year's failings.

2)Organising protests with the help of cops.
Didn't organise them with the help of cops. Told the cops what we were doing and that was it.

3)pulling out of any direct action.
??? Obviously you forgot the Occupations, Students being chained to Dail, Dept Of Ed, FF HQ, Dept of Ed Athlone. And do Mass Protests not count as direct action anymore?

4)Having nice meetings in their boardroom, discussing the mood of the students.
Never discussed the mood of students in the boardroom. Had meetings to discuss the state of the National Campaign and things like that, but that was about it.

5)furthering their carreer options.
Yeah. Student Politics is such a hugely well paying job all right.

6)having cups of tea with minister monkeyface.
Never had a cup of tea with Dempsey. Met him twice last year, that was it. Would you prefer USI not meet with the Minister?

7)writing anti-cfe patronising bullshit in their glossy ad-mag
Anti-Cfe? Where?

by Michael Thu Aug 07, 2003 16:14

Why dont you just go off sailing again. You did nothing in office.

by Gaz Thu Aug 07, 2003 16:57

all that time out of college must have affected your reading skills, i didnt post that stuff conor did.

by Gaz - indie lib. socialist Thu Aug 07, 2003 17:07

1)Nothing much for ages.
The fact that USI were so in previous years had nothing to do with me, or most of last year's officerboard. That's like blaming this year's UCDSU exec for last year's failings.

Conor WAS talking about last year, read his post

2)why bother telling the cops

3)what about disowning the students involved in direct action

4)Having nice meetings in their boardroom, discussing the mood of the students.

Kind of ironic that USI complain about student hardship and then go and spend students money (even those on the grant) on nice big leather chairs for your boardroom so you can talk about the ever-so poor students.

7)so you didnt patronise us about our poor spelling, taoiseach was mispelled on a forum not some offical document for fucks sake.

by Noel Hogan Thu Aug 07, 2003 17:30

why bother telling the cops?
- Probably because trying to lead a march through Dublin, Galway, Limerick or wherever without telling the Cops would end up with a serious accident as 2-3000 students try to compete with cars and HGVs for roadspace.

what about disowning the students involved in direct action
- Examples?

Having nice meetings in their boardroom, discussing the mood of the students.

Kind of ironic that USI complain about student hardship and then go and spend students money (even those on the grant) on nice big leather chairs for your boardroom so you can talk about the ever-so poor students.
- Plastic, not Leather. Hardly lots of money anyhow, Ceann Aras is basically a prefabbed office. Can't see why people get upset about it.


7)so you didnt patronise us about our poor spelling, taoiseach was mispelled on a forum not some offical document for fucks sake

Oh dear, what a huge issue. And I didn't write that article anyhow, or edit the Mag.

by Conor - UCDSA/CFE Thu Aug 07, 2003 17:55 conor at ziplip dot com

1)Nothing much for ages.

The fact that USI were so in previous years had nothing to do with me, or most of last year's officerboard. That's like blaming this year's UCDSU exec for last year's failings.

- i was blaming last years usi officer board for last years ffailings.

2)Organising protests with the help of cops.

Didn't organise them with the help of cops. Told the cops what we were doing and that was it.

http://library.nothingness.org/articles/SI/en/display/4

the UNION protects the intrests of the STUDENTS , AGAINST the intrests of the state. you do not tell the state when youre organising actions for STUDENTS. simple. you discoraged any independent action, direct or otherwise by students at the "march", controlled it with the cops, and made sure that there was nothing for students there apart from the usual shite filled spinster tds, and usi/ su hacks.

3)pulling out of any direct action.
??? Obviously you forgot the Occupations, Students being chained to Dail, Dept Of Ed, FF HQ, Dept of Ed Athlone. And do Mass Protests not count as direct action anymore?

chained to Dail - fair enough. well done usi

Dept Of Ed - usi offered no assistance to the students it setup there, apart from colm jordans media interviews. no legal support or otherwise - yes , i know you and keogh were in there!

Mass Protests not count as direct action anymore?
not when YOU stupid fucks call in the cops.



4)Having nice meetings in their boardroom, discussing the mood of the students.

Never discussed the mood of students in the boardroom. Had meetings to discuss the state of the National Campaign and things like that, but that was about it.

nice waste of more student cash

5)furthering their carreer options.

Yeah. Student Politics is such a hugely well paying job all right.

whereas national politics (the aim of any student politician) does earn a deal more than any other job that twats like yourselves can find. first fuckup the students movement, then the country.

6)having cups of tea with minister monkeyface.

Never had a cup of tea with Dempsey. Met him twice last year, that was it. Would you prefer USI not meet with the Minister?

yes USI should meet mr monobrow. that is about the only thing usi has going for it at the moment. although id like someone competent, articulate, and with the intrests of students in mind to meet the minister, and then explain exactly what was said .not colm jordan and noel hogan.

7)writing anti-cfe patronising bullshit in their glossy ad-mag

Anti-Cfe? Where?

in "the voice" or whatever you call it. another total fucking waste of money. just like you noel, and this years officer board, and their boardroom.
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http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/text/bushmail.html
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by Gaz - indie lib. socialist Thu Aug 07, 2003 17:58

- why bother telling the cops?
thats right let them prepare, let them erect barriers to keep us from upsetting anyone and engaing in direct action or anything - i guess it just comes down to difference of opinion.

- Having nice meetings in their boardroom, discussing the mood of the students.

your time would have been better spent actually talking to students instead of sitting round an office in the first place. USI has a terrible reputation among average students who fail to see USI engaging with them in campuses (did i spell that right?)

- the article

Trying to discredit and patronize a group of students, with little resources, who spent most of the college year trying to help fight fees is pretty cheap.

but anyway this could go on for ages, what plans have USI got for dealing with the 37% cut, the registration fee it hasn't gone away, the inequities in the means testing system still exist and what about intervention at an early age to combat educational disasdvantge. What has Will got rolled up his sleeves. He's been equally harsh on USI in the past (even campaigning to disaffiliate) it'll be interesting to see how many students he can get to send postcards...or have a silent protest with people wearing t-shirts? or maybe he'll get rid of the Environmental Rights campaign, Irish Language Campaign, Womens' Rights Campaign, and to get rid of the Postgraduate Officer like he's said he wants to.

by james redmond. - socialist alternative Thu Aug 07, 2003 17:59

'what about disowning the students involved in direct action
- Examples?'

Did USI not 'distance' itself in the papers from the sit-down outside the Dail after the February 5th demonstration? Then did Colm Jordon not appear with his hands clutching his face in national papers just before the Ministers announcment saying how he had notified the Garda Commisioner through a letter, that he was 'washing his hands' of the possible actions of students over the fees issue?

by Again Thu Aug 07, 2003 17:59

http://www.rte.ie/tv/cabinfever/biogs/noelhogan.html

Nice

by Durutti Thu Aug 07, 2003 18:04

Asked about his greatest achievement, Noel says, "That would have to be getting Noel Dempsey to back down on bringing back student fees. Along with others in USI, I worked long and hard and lobbied furiously to make sure that fees weren't brought in and I'm very proud of the fact that we stopped that. Free education is still free education as long as I'm around."

If Noel had one wish, apart from being on Cabin Fever, it would be to be An Taoiseach. He says, "Because I'd do a better job than Bozo Ahern and, going back to earlier stuff, it's the only way to make a difference about something".

His favourite possession is his mountain bike because 'it keeps me fit and is more dangerous than football." - Must be a motorised Mountain bike!!

http://www.rte.ie/tv/cabinfever/biogs/noelhogan.html

Checkout our Noel

by Gaz Thu Aug 07, 2003 18:14

right after he occupied the dept of education the Star rang up and said they wanted to do a photoshoot of the people involved. The catch was the star wanted them to dress as cowboys. It didn't go ahead though cos people like James and Finbar thought it would discredit the whole student "movement"

imagine noel in his cowboy gear. Bang! Bang! Noel in his chaps

by Noel Hogan Thu Aug 07, 2003 18:32

" was blaming last years usi officer board for last years ffailings."

Ok so, no problem. It was indeed a massive failing to stop the reintroduction of fees, and get €40+ million for disadvantaged access. Total washout altogether!! I'm happy to have a hand in causing that "failure".

"he UNION protects the intrests of the STUDENTS , AGAINST the intrests of the state. you do not tell the state when youre organising actions for STUDENTS. simple. you discoraged any independent action, direct or otherwise by students at the "march", controlled it with the cops, and made sure that there was nothing for students there apart from the usual shite filled spinster tds, and usi/ su hacks."

- Let's see you try that when someone gets knocked down. Guaranteeing student safety IS protecting the interests of students, which is why we told the cops what we were doing. Can't have it both ways I'm afraid.

"ept Of Ed - usi offered no assistance to the students it setup there, apart from colm jordans media interviews. no legal support or otherwise - yes , i know you and keogh were in there!"
- well that's good. What assistance had you in mind? Jordan said that day that USI would fight any charges brought against those in the building, guess you missed that.

"ass Protests not count as direct action anymore?
not when YOU stupid fucks call in the cops."
- already answered that point.


"hereas national politics (the aim of any student politician) does earn a deal more than any other job that twats like yourselves can find. first fuckup the students movement, then the country."
- Oh dear. If it conforts you, I'll go shovel yak dung in Tibet and live in poverty for the rest of my life.


"although id like someone competent, articulate, and with the intrests of students in mind to meet the minister, and then explain exactly what was said .not colm jordan and noel hogan."
- Good for you.

"in "the voice" or whatever you call it. another total fucking waste of money. just like you noel, and this years officer board, and their boardroom."
- Oh get over it. Sorry for wounding your fragile ego with criticism. What's up, like dishing it out but can't take it?

"why bother telling the cops?
thats right let them prepare, let them erect barriers to keep us from upsetting anyone and engaing in direct action or anything - i guess it just comes down to difference of opinion."
That's right, you have yours and I have mine. As far as I'm concerned, better barriers outside the dail than students getting run over.


"your time would have been better spent actually talking to students instead of sitting round an office in the first place. USI has a terrible reputation among average students who fail to see USI engaging with them in campuses (did i spell that right?)"
- We did. Sorry if we didn't get out to UCD much, but Aonghus had me kicked off campus when I was out there. And UCD isn't the centre of the universe you know.



"Did USI not 'distance' itself in the papers from the sit-down outside the Dail after the February 5th demonstration?"
- Yup, we wanted the country to see 10,000 students protesting that day. Instead, what the country saw was 200 students sitting on a road. That weakened the impact of the day and made it look like only a minority of students gave a shit. Your mistake, not ours.

Then did Colm Jordon not appear with his hands clutching his face in national papers just before the Ministers announcment saying how he had notified the Garda Commisioner through a letter, that he was 'washing his hands' of the possible actions of students over the fees issue?

- Wow, the press got a pic of him and you read so much into it. He said he can't be responsible for student actions, but that USI won't condemn any actions taken by students. A week after that we occupied the Dept of Social and Family and Affairs, Students chained themselves to the dail and Occupied transport. Hardly "selling out" on Direct action.

Anyhow, this debate is academic. Last year saw a big success for students. Try looking to the future and repeating that success, rather than the past and whinging.

by james Thu Aug 07, 2003 18:47

'A week after that we occupied the Dept of Social and Family and Affairs, Students chained themselves to the dail and Occupied transport. Hardly "selling out" on Direct action.'

The statement came after the events you mention above, in the days prior to two demonstrations planned by CFE. I've always seen USI as having a habit of being a small bunch of bureaucrats runnin garound trying to manufacture the illusion of a mass student movement, that is what the day of action with the chaining to the dail gates and occupation intended to do, and is also evident in that daft idea you have Noel of identifying grassroots students dissillusionment with USI as a failure on your behalf to get out to the campus and hand out some glossy magazine full of coupons. A union is more than its officer board, and that is something USI didn't grasp last year, as there was no attempt to involve students and encourage the self activity needed for a mass campaign against fees. We may have won, but i'd be hesitant to say it was because of the student movement, that'd be too naive.

'Along with others in USI, I worked long and hard and lobbied furiously to make sure that fees weren't brought in and I'm very proud of the fact that we stopped that. Free education is still free education as long as I'm around."

If we are to force this government to back down on cutbacks across the board, it's not going to be through the actions of the officerboard, but through the self organisation of students at the root and the creation of local activist based unions. That is something you show'd to have no interesst in doing last year. It may be academic, but i think it's important we recognise the problems of last year so we can advance in the future. On a basic level, if we had never realised academically USI was isolated and going no where, we wouldn't have formed CFE, and would have sat scratching our holes watching Treasure Island waiting for someone to fight fees for us.

by Gaz - CFE personal capacity Thu Aug 07, 2003 18:53

- we wanted the country to see 10,000 students protesting that day. Instead, what the country saw was 200 students sitting on a road. That weakened the impact of the day and made it look like only a minority of students gave a shit. Your mistake, not ours.

non-long winded version - we wanted pics of us in the paper leading a protest of 10,000 students and we would have gotten away with it if it wasn't for those pesky students. God forbid students should act their rage.

by Noel Hogan Thu Aug 07, 2003 19:11

"evident in that daft idea you have Noel of identifying grassroots students dissillusionment with USI as a failure on your behalf to get out to the campus and hand out some glossy magazine full of coupons."

- Only reason I was doing that in UCD is because I was asked to by some UCD students. AS before, UCD is not the centre of the Universe. Officer board went onto every other campus in the country to build support for Demos. The fact that we weren't on UCD was down to Aonghus & Co.


"A union is more than its officer board, and that is something USI didn't grasp last year, as there was no attempt to involve students and encourage the self activity needed for a mass campaign against fees."

- So getting students out on the street, getting them to lobby their TDs en masse, getting 40,000 of them onto the streets is not encouraging mass activity against fees?

"If we are to force this government to back down on cutbacks across the board, it's not going to be through the actions of the officerboard"
- Hence all the mass demonstrations last year.


"but through the self organisation of students at the root and the creation of local activist based unions. That is something you show'd to have no interesst in doing last year."

- Maybe it was because of trying to win in one year, rather than building up to win in ten years. Winning to me is more important than how you win. In the end, I doubt students really gave a shit what way they stopped fees, as long as they stopped them. And anyhow, the student movement needed a success to build on, and got one last year. What happened last year doesn't rule out a more active student movement, in fact it makes it more possible.

"non-long winded version - we wanted pics of us in the paper leading a protest of 10,000 students and we would have gotten away with it if it wasn't for those pesky students. God forbid students should act their rage"

- Or you felt that getting yourself your mates in the paper was more important than showing the country that thousands of students were opposed to the government. 10,000 marched, 200 sat down. That works out at 50:1.

by Gaz - anarchist but secretly wants to be the vanguard Thu Aug 07, 2003 21:23

cfe doesn't belive in organisng protests so the press can take a few pics of students with the USI officer board in the foreground only to send hundreds (if not thousands) of students back across the country once the photos have been taken. to us thats not building a movement.im not going into the movement argue we've done it in the yahoo group.http://groups.yahoo.com/group/campaignforfreeeducation/message/77 we look to get students, tired of walking up and down o' connell street, involved, to give them a feeling that they're really doing something as opposed to being extras in a photo that can go up on the wall at USI HQ.

by conor - ucdsa/cfe Fri Aug 08, 2003 10:56 conor at ziplip dot com

1)Nothing much for ages.
- The usi did nothing with regard to fees when the news came out around this time last year, bar dumping 69 ducks in the liffey (photo op no 1 for colm noel and the boys)

2)Organising protests with the help of cops.

the usi's idea of a protest involves people being hoarded into a cattle pen to listen to colm (photo op no ?) jordan, noel hogan, enda kenny, and whicheversuch td students dont want to listen to , and rightly hold as irrelavant.

note : usi claim 10000 students turned up that day. not 1 i have talked talk to since ,that i managed to get to come along from the class,said they were empowered in any way,and were all more bored than by yunus a cegnels rants on thermodynamics.

thats 10000 wasted opportunities on behalf of usi

3)pulling out of any direct action.

'usi is not responsible for the actions of students' - or something to that effect (colm j in a letter to garda pat b)

5 paid usi hacks chaining themselves to the dail is a photo opportunity, not direct action. i wouldnt classify a postcard campaign as direct action either.

other direct actions usually followed the formula of - cfe do an action, usi realise theyre loosing face with students, the next tuesday usi call an occupation/chaining to gates, some other students (sometimes cfe heads) go along too, usi hacks talk to press, usi hacks ring students and tell them that theyre on their own.

4)Having nice meetings in their boardroom, discussing the mood of the students.

this point means -

usi is out of touch with los plebs (us students who feel a need to represent ourselves in the face of such gross negligance and incompetence)

usi waste students not-so-plentyful money on such nonsense as boardrooms.

5)furthering their carreer options.

as i said, the usi officer board (the ones ive come accross) are not the most employable/employerable spanners known to mankind (outside the field of politics of course)

6)having cups of tea with minister monkeyface.

this is something usi did, which i think most prople aggree with, good stuff.

7)writing anti-cfe patronising bullshit in their glossy ad-mag.

more of a laugh, except for the fact that here is a national union, which , when given the budget (and by the sheen on those pages, there was a budget) to communicate with their student body, allocates MORE space editorially to slagging off the cfe ( a group that few outside of dublin had heard of) than to addressing the fees issue!!!! i mean for fucks sake **

fact; the usi failed in its mandate to protect students agagint the reintroduction of fees, and only did so when spurred into action by the autonomious actions of a few students who gave as much as a fuck

fact; the usi is considered more irrelavant by the dept of education , than by its own members- and thats saying something. 2 meetings mean very very little. do you honestly think, noel , that anyone at state level is afraid of the actions of, or respects he opinion of usi? i dont think so, and i think the reasons for that is usi's inaction and stupidity as both individiuals and a group.

fac51; the usi have ? paid up officers, and a whole lot of emptyness to show for it.

time to sell off that stylish"usi officer board" rugby top, and head down town to the sleazy-sweaty-fat politician suit fitter?


** i have the said issue at home.

by anon Fri Aug 08, 2003 11:49

Colm Jordan went for the job of FF Youth Development Officer a few weeks ago, and didn't get the job. He also ran for a FF nomination in the local elections- in the Blackrock ward in Dún Laoghaire Rathdown and didn't get it.

It's interesting to see that some on the UCD left are now criticising the USI leadership- some of you didn't say a word when the USI disaffiliation referendum was on!

by UCD student Fri Aug 08, 2003 12:51

Noel Hogan And Gareth Keogh were the only two on USI officer board that actually tried to moblise students and partook in Direct action. The ones that should should be criticesed are last years DITSU TCDSU UCDSU who opposed all forms of Direct action. Whilst direct Actions by hoel +gareth mayy not have been perfect at least they tried. Don't forget USI is mandated to do what it does by member college executives

by King Mob Fri Aug 08, 2003 14:11

Get a fucking job and stop dossing and sponging off the state you dossing fucking bums.

by Noel Hogan Fri Aug 08, 2003 14:53

"we look to get students, tired of walking up and down o' connell street, involved, to give them a feeling that they're really doing something as opposed to being extras in a photo that can go up on the wall at USI HQ."

- So did we, hence the encouraging students to get involved in the campaign, organise a protest, lobby their TDs (remember www.fightfees.com) and so fourth.

"The usi did nothing with regard to fees when the news came out around this time last year, bar dumping 69 ducks in the liffey (photo op no 1 for colm noel and the boys)"

- And from there went on to escalate the campaign and engage in more direct action.

"the usi's idea of a protest involves people being hoarded into a cattle pen to listen to colm (photo op no ?) jordan, noel hogan, enda kenny, and whicheversuch td students dont want to listen to , and rightly hold as irrelavant."

- Good to see you're arrogant enough to claim that you can speak for all students on this, including Labour students, FG students, Green etc etc. I make no apology for accepting the support of anybody in last year's campaign, including FG, Labour and so on.

"usi claim 10000 students turned up that day. not 1 i have talked talk to since ,that i managed to get to come along from the class,said they were empowered in any way,and were all more bored than by yunus a cegnels rants on thermodynamics."

- That was the cops estimate, they're not usually given to exxagerating protests like this. And who did you talk to anyhow? About 10 of your like minded mates from UCD I'd say. Come back to me when you did a proper survey, or at least talked to someone with a different political viewpoint than yourself.



"pulling out of any direct action".
- As I said, the only way you can say that is by forgetting the occupations and demos. Wait, I got it, a USI organised chaining protest is a photo op, but if you did the same thing it would be direct action. And I've already said the sit down after the big demo was a dumb idea. For every 1 student that did your idea, 50 did ours. So who's representative now?

"cfe do an action, usi realise theyre loosing face with students, the next tuesday usi call an occupation/chaining to gates, some other students (sometimes cfe heads) go along too, usi hacks talk to press, usi hacks ring students and tell them that theyre on their own."

- I'm finding it hard to remember the occupation that took place before the USI organised one in Sept, or May. Enlighten me please. And seeing as we had planned mass demos as early as July your point is plainly wrong.


"usi is out of touch with los plebs (us students who feel a need to represent ourselves in the face of such gross negligance and incompetence)"

- Well, you can have your opinion. As far as I'm concerned, you're the one out of touch. 50:1, remember?

"usi waste students not-so-plentyful money on such nonsense as boardrooms."
- Every Trade Union HQ has a boardroom, so I can't see why you're getting worried about it.

"as i said, the usi officer board (the ones ive come accross) are not the most employable/employerable spanners known to mankind (outside the field of politics of course)"
- Whatever officerboard do after they're finished in USI is none of my concern, or yours. As I said, if it makes you happy I'll move to Tibet and shovel yak dung for 1 cent a day.


"more of a laugh, except for the fact that here is a national union, which , when given the budget (and by the sheen on those pages, there was a budget) to communicate with their student body, allocates MORE space editorially to slagging off the cfe ( a group that few outside of dublin had heard of) than to addressing the fees issue!!!! i mean for fucks sake **"
- Wow. A one page article upsets your fragile little ego. It wasn't even very critical, the headline said "march on student soldiers" which sounds like encouragement to me. Oh, and the Voice makes money, it doesn't lose it. And obviously you missed all the articles in previous issues about the National Campaign.



"the usi is considered more irrelavant by the dept of education , than by its own members- and thats saying something. 2 meetings mean very very little. do you honestly think, noel , that anyone at state level is afraid of the actions of, or respects he opinion of usi? i dont think so, and i think the reasons for that is usi's inaction and stupidity as both individiuals and a group."

- So irrelevant that they ask us to sit on the HEA, Focus Groups on access & equality and other bodies. And seeing as we won on fees last year, it's obvious that someone up there does respect us. And the only members who had little time for us last year was the Aonghus & Co and yourself, and you can hardly claim that either are representative of students as a whole.

"the usi have ? paid up officers, and a whole lot of emptyness to show for it."

- As long as you ignore everything USI did last year.

by FK Fri Aug 08, 2003 17:12

At times throughout the last year members of SA acted as cheerleaders for the USI bureacracy, the complete refusal to raise any critisisms of the USI leadership during the USI referendum in UCD is one example. I am glad to see that members of SA are finally giving some critisism of USI.

by conor - sa Sat Aug 09, 2003 13:23

christmas:

i dont spend much time in lefty circles on campus, and the friends i talked to were all non-party, non leftist people in my class, who either havnt heard of usi, dont know what it is, dont know theyre a member, or, that its a group of 10 people or so in a boardroom of sorts.

i dont have an ego, fragile or otherwise, and if i did, it wouldnt be shattered by an aritcle about a group im a member of in a glossy student publication ad magazine produced by some overwieght overmulletted spanner like yourself.

the reason 10000 people didnt get involved in direct action outside the dail (they did on o connell bridge - briefly) was that they were cattle penned in by the cops and the cops were out in force because......

i think i speak for more students than you do. most students (as in 95+ %) arent in labour fine gael, sinn fein etc, and see parlamentary politics as corrupt, irrelavant, and unworthy. they think the same of usi.

most unions in this country are shite. most unions in this country are in partnership, most unions in this country have board rooms, most unions in this country are led by the same kinds of sheepish gobshites that lead the student movement.

http://library.nothingness.org/articles/SI/en/display/4

youre last comment re boardrooms just illustrates the point beautifully.

and finally, i wouldnt wish you on anyone - if the mud diggers of yemen were unionised by people like yourself, they would be earning less than $1 a week, and would proberbally have to hand the most of that over to pay for the products advertised in your magazines, or your lavish headquarters, or your ambision to change the country by becoming taoiseach.

{i- along with others in sa campaigned against
usi disaffilaition last year on the grounds of the need for a strong national union, not on the peformance of the present officer board}

by conor again Sat Aug 09, 2003 13:34

the real enemy, is the enemy within.

it is well known what sorts the likes of aonghus hourihane and will priestly are, the sort of shite noel and gareth stand for, while still being "right on" or whatever is much more dangerous.

remember colm the shit at the first cfe meeting,failing,but trying to convince me and you "ucd student" that theres no need for any radical cfe group while he and his lefty labour mates are around ?

look what happened to that same colm!!

by Sick of this sectarian oppurtuinist shit Sat Aug 09, 2003 14:33

In what demented dark corner of your mind do you think of this shit Finghin? Why is it anytime UCD is mentioned someone from the SP comes on and rants against SA? Now I have no speicial love for them but I have met members and have been impressed by them. Ive seen them in operation and it has to be said they dont try and flog a paper to everyone present, which is an improvement from the cultish outlook of the SP and SWP.
I met some in Evian and was expecting some crazy right-wing whack jobs but was pleasently suprised

Cop yourselves on, you are obviously committed, so all due respects, but have some respect for other groups out there and stop indulging in petty character assassination.

by FK Sat Aug 09, 2003 16:32

I was not trying to paint SA as a right wing group or trying to 'carachter assasinate' them. I do have due respect for SA and others that built CFE,I have worked closely with them on various campaigns in UCD. However I think it would be wrong to hide away important differences between the different groups on the left, an honest, comradely political discussion can only benefit the movement as a whole.

I genuinely think it is good that members of SA are now giving justified critisism of USI. Conor has rightly pointed out the the right wing leaders of the student movement that are memeber and supporters of the establishment parties are a serious impedemant to a fight against fees and cuts. We in CFE need to be quite honest with students and explain that a fight against this government will also involve a fight against the leadership of USI and most of the local unions.

by Gaz - indie. lib. socialist Sat Aug 09, 2003 22:29

Noel- "For every 1 student that did your idea, 50 did ours. So who's representative now?"

How can USI can claim to be representative is beyond me. CFE actively tried to establish links and grass root opposition against fees among secondary students, parents councils and guidance councillers despite being a group of full-time students, some with part-time jobs, who've little or no resources. Anyone could come along to a meeting and have a say in our actions, in fact people were encouraged to do so, we didn't sit around in an office staring at pictures of ourselves on the walls. USI are full timers and practically state employed so-called 'representatives'. How many students voted for Noel or Colm? How many students had a say in USIs actions?

when comparing the relative success of cfe and usi you conviently ignore the huge resources at your disposal, and the fact that youre all employed full-time, while cfe was a group of students, studying for exams, holding down part-time jobs etc with practically no resources.

FK- "At times throughout the last year members of SA acted as cheerleaders for the USI bureacracy, "

i think thats taking it a bit far, all of the members of SA i talk to spew out some pretty vitriolic rhetoric when it comes to USI. If we went round saying what we really thought of USI i doubt the no campign would have as high a no vote as we did. But all that crap is in the past anyway. As you said, and was stated in the No campaigns literature, usi has to be reformed to make it more relevant among students, and more of a force on the political scence. The problem with this is, the usi beauracracy prevents students from having a say so its left up to the (mostly FF/right wing) sabbats.The problem remains - how can USI actually be reformed?

by SP member Sun Aug 10, 2003 16:07

Gary, I have to disagree with you when you say: "If we went round saying what we really thought of USI i doubt the no campaign would have as high a no vote as we did."

In my opinion the No vote could even have been higher and with higher turnout if the campaign adopted a stance of critical support of the USI. (I don't think it was an accident that the highest No vote was in the Law faculty- and with a high turnout).

The referendum was an excellant opportunity to put forward views on what the USI should be and how it can be transformed. Students would have reacted very positivly to a campaign which recognised the failings of the USI and put forward ideas on how it can be changed.

Unfortunatly some were of the opinion that no criticism of the USI leadership could be put forward- these included members of Socialist Alternative. I don't think you can say that this is "all in the past" as it is an indication of very different approaches to referendums, campaigns and Unions.

For example I will pose a question:
Which would be better?
Spreading our views on transforming USI and loosing the referendum
OR
Not spreading our views on transforming the USI and winning the referendum?

Some believed (and still do belive) that the key thing was USI membership rather than the struggle to transform our local SU and create a fighting national union which USI membership may play a part in.

by Gaz - indie. lib. socialist Sun Aug 10, 2003 20:48

I don’t want to speak on behalf of an organisation im not a member of, but I think SA would have problems being labelled “cheerleaders of the USI bureaucracy”. The reason I say its “all in the past” is because it is. Instead of concentrating on the balance of support and criticsm, and issues like what the name of the group organising the campagin should have been, we should concentrate on reforming USI in order to make it into (to borrow one of the SPs favourite expressions) ‘a democratic fighting students union’. Of course we should always learn lessons from the past but we should concentrate on the future.

Noel hogans comment, “so who’s reprsentative now?” only highlights the problems with USI. Unlike USI, CFE didn’t see itself as representatives of students, it was a group of students actively opposed to educational disadvantage. USI sees itself merely as representatives (!) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/campaignforfreeeducation/message/80 and fails to actively engage its membership on a regular basis. The only way that a student movement can be developed is from the base, not from the top down. Dressing as a cowboy, chaining yourself to some gates for a few minutes, typing your name and clicking send on a website doesn’t create a movement of students, who are not merely opposed to fees and in favour of grant improvements, but students who are opposed to and regularly fight against all the barriers to education.

In my opinion, organisations similar to cfe should be set up in colleges and universities across ireland, to work with, and along-side student unions. Through self-organisation, actively engaging and empowering students at a grassroots level a movement could begin to evolve, a movement which would widen the argument to encompass barriers to education in primary and secondary level education as opposed to merely the barriers faced by students who are lucky enough to have stayed in school and to have gotten the points needed to get into third level education. Through direct action, collective mass action, making colleges a hostile place for the government, and expanding the ideological argument against barriers to education, organisations similar to CFE could sow the seeds of a grassroots movement. The next logical step would be for these groups to then go on and reclaim student unions from the careerist hacks which have been dominant for too long, thereby taking advantage of the resources available to the individual SUs, in order to further the movement. Once this has been accomplished and the foundation has been laid, the opportunity to really reform USI into a national union which engages its membership and becomes a force on the politcal scene, becomes a reality. By electing people who are willing to actively confront the government and engage its membership, as opposed to hacks that Fianna Fail don’t even want, a major change in the way USI operates could be achieved.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/campaignforfreeeducation for discussion on education

http://www.educationet.org/z0281.html an overview of why cfe was set up, what it did and what it learned

http://www.c-f-e.cjb.net for reports on cfes activities & policies

by Noel Hogan Mon Aug 11, 2003 16:04

"I am glad to see that members of SA are finally giving some critisism of USI."

- Just a pity that the criticism of USI is so shit that it can be easily rebuffed.


""the reason 10000 people didnt get involved in direct action outside the dail (they did on o connell bridge - briefly) was that they were cattle penned in by the cops and the cops were out in force because......"

- They were co-ordinating traffic, for one reason. No Cops = no traffic management = run over students. In addition, if you're going to plug the event like it deserves, with posters, leaflets, class addresses and so on, the cops will easily get wind of it. So in that case, it's a case of managing reality.

"i think i speak for more students than you do. most students (as in 95+ %) arent in labour fine gael, sinn fein etc, and see parlamentary politics as corrupt, irrelavant, and unworthy. they think the same of usi."

- Good for you. I don't agree with you. Funny how the 95% figure is not reflected in elections, or referenda, or anything like that. You seem to believe you have a talent for mindreading!

"most unions in this country are shite. most unions in this country are in partnership, most unions in this country have board rooms, most unions in this country are led by the same kinds of sheepish gobshites that lead the student movement. "

- If you're so upset about it I don't see any action on your part. As far as I'm concerned, you don't want to change it because it would mean you woundn't be able to moan about it anymore. And moaning and whinging seems very important to you.


"and finally, i wouldnt wish you on anyone"
- Likewise. What good is a whiner to anyone?


"it is well known what sorts the likes of aonghus hourihane and will priestly are, the sort of shite noel and gareth stand for, while still being "right on" or whatever is much more dangerous."
- Yes, of course. And what Occupations/Demos was Aonghus involved in. Didn't see him that day in the Dept of Education.

"remember colm the shit at the first cfe meeting,failing,but trying to convince me and you "ucd student" that theres no need for any radical cfe group while he and his lefty labour mates are around ?"

- he was talking about cooperating, a different idea, one that's alien to you obviously. Remember, the idea we're fighting is fees?



when comparing the relative success of cfe and usi you conviently ignore the huge resources at your disposal, and the fact that youre all employed full-time, while cfe was a group of students, studying for exams, holding down part-time jobs etc with practically no resources.

- So you agree that USI had a successful year last year? Looks like reality is breaking through the doublethink at last!



"In my opinion, organisations similar to cfe should be set up in colleges and universities across ireland, to work with, and along-side student unions. "

My opinion too. But with people like Conor, who prefers fighting USI to fighting fees, it's unlikely to happen.

by Cian Mon Aug 11, 2003 16:52

As someone who has organised student demos and has liased and not liased with cops a couple of points.

If the protest is been built for publicly the cops will know about it, whether you ring them or not. If you don't ring them they get a little pissed off, put on twice the amount of cops and prepare for direct action.

If you ring them they tend not to expect direct action and put on less cops.

Also even if you arrive unannounced at Kildare Street the cops do not need anytime to prepare and erect barricading material. In fact if you go up to the Dáil anytime you will notice that they have a large amount of barricades ready made that can be put into use in about 30 seconds.

So while I agree that there is a need for action that doesn't always conform within the principles that the state wants, whether you ring the cops or not little changes.

In fairness for a national student union USI mobilised more students this year than ever before in the history of Ireland (about 30,000). CFE, on the other has mobilised a few hundred. Thats not to take away from what CFE did, nor is it to say that there isn't a need for grassroots activism.

USI is a national union, and as national unions go it did a pretty good job last year considering the constraints it was working under (taking orders from people like Aengus Hourrihane).

Grassroots activism on the other hand was pretty poor with the notable exception of a bit of stuff happening in parts of UCD. Any idea that grassroots activism can emerge from a bunch of officers in offices in Grattan Place is mistaken no matter who you have in those offices.

Pretty much the limit to what an organisation like USI can do is organise a large number of mass demonstrations and some direct action as well. This they did, the rest was up to us.

by Gaz - indie. lib. socialist Mon Aug 11, 2003 20:59

“Remember, the idea we're fighting is fees?”

Wrong, we’re fighting against all barriers to education. We’ve ‘won’ on the fees issue, this alone is not going to significantly improve the numbers of diadvantaged students entering third level education. With the spotlight on education over the past year the opportunity to widen the argument on how to really help the disadvantaged, and move it away simply from fees, imho was largely missed.

“So you agree that USI had a successful year last year? Looks like reality is breaking through the doublethink at last!”

if you read my comment carefully I said relative success, ie fees and grants (USI and cfes influence shouldn’t be overestimated). But this will only help people who are fortunate enough to stay in school and get the points, what about the thousands who aren’t so lucky?, it wont help eliminate educational disadvantage in primary and secondary education. Barriers to education don’t suddenly appear when u get your leaving cert results, they appear the moment you enter the system. The decision on fees and grants is hugely welcomed (even if the means test is still hugely flawed) but if last year was a success, then hit me in the head with an ice-pick and call me Trotsky.

The School Retention Initiative cut by €6million. This scheme is designed to reduce the school drop-out rate.

€5m cut from programmes aimed at attracting socio-economically disadvantaged school-leavers to third level.

The Back to Education Initiative has been cut by €3.8million. This provides for adults returning to education.

A cut of €6million in in-service teacher-training courses.

A cut of €6.2million in IT research and development.

Teacher recruitment and training has been been cut by €6.7million.

The student registration charge was increased last September from €396 to €670, an increase of 69%, a cutback worth in the region of €16million. Colleges have warned that they may need to increase the registration charge to €1,400 if they are to maintain the existing level of services in the face of cutbacks in public spending.

The Back to Education Allowance Scheme has been restructured. The Allowance is aimed at assisting those who are unemployed, are single parents or have a disability, to pursue approved second-or third-level education courses. The Minister for Social and Family Affairs has reversed some of the cuts but it will no longer be paid to those on long-term unemployment or over the summer months in certain categories.

The School Building Programme published in January 2003 saw hundreds of school building projects frozen at the architectural planning stage. Only 26 building starts at primary and secondary will begin in 2003. In order to fund a pilot programme for 20 selected schools to complete work on a devolved basis, the Minister takes €20m from the third level building programme.

In the book of Estimates published in November 2002, funding for building, equipment and furnishing of national schools was cut by 4%, funding for building, equipment and furnishing of secondary schools was cut by 10%, and funding for building, equipment and furnishing of third level institutions was cut by 33% i.e. a cut in third level building projects of €42million in 2003.

The Student Summer Jobs Scheme has been abolished. This allowed students in third level to work in their communities over the summer months to earn a maximum of €600 for a maximum of 200 hours.

The Minister has withdrawn the payment of the physical education grant to disadvantaged schools for 2003. The grant (worth €635) for supporting the teaching of PE and sports in disadvantaged schools was introduced in October 2000.

The Department of Education is also “reviewing” the payment and level of the Grant Scheme for Minor Works (also known as the capitation grant) to all schools. This annual payment (a lump sum currently worth €3,809) is paid to schools for minor repairs and maintenance works along with the payment of €12.70 per pupil.

There has been no increase in the “alleviation of disadvantage” subhead under third level education Estimate for 2003. €26million was allocated in 2002. This allocation remains the same for 2003.

Not to mention the cutback that started this thread

If all this happens in a year USI calls ‘a success’ then god help us all.

- “In my opinion, organisations similar to cfe should be set up in colleges and universities across ireland, to work with, and along-side student unions. "
My opinion too. But with people like Conor, who prefers fighting USI to fighting fees, it's unlikely to happen.

Conor spent a lot of last year fighting fees, the only reason people” fight” against USI is because they realise the huge potential it has and want it to fulfill its potential. If you really want organisations like cfe springing up around the country then why don’t you actively encourage it, give them some small funding so they can print flyers, posters etc until they can become self sufficient and raise funds themselves.

- “In fairness for a national student union USI mobilised more students this year than ever before in the history of Ireland (about 30,000).

True enough. it managed to get students to walk for about 20 minutes, listen to some speeches/TDs looking for votes etc then told them to ring their TDs. Its good that USI managed to get them out for awhile but whats needed to really make inroads into barriers to education is to get these 30,000 actively involved throughout the year instead of an hour or two a year. How many of the 30,000 did USI even get to use fightfees.com? Like cfe said, if the government continues to block students access to college, then students should block their access to colleges. It doesn’t take much to organise a protest at the arrival of a member of the government. A mass protest is welcome and has a part to play but it must be combined with sustained activity.

-"I am glad to see that members of SA are finally giving some critisism of USI."
Just a pity that the criticism of USI is so shit that it can be easily rebuffed.

How is dressing up as a cowboy going to break down barriers to education and get student issues to be taken more seriously? I can just imagine every member of the government looking at the star and laughing.

Chaining yourself to some railings for a few minutes,as you’ve stated in this thread, shows that only a minority of students care. Its yet another photo op and no real attempt to piss off the government.

The last occupation was a joke. It was poorly organised (I use the word organised loosley), people didn’t know what they were getting themselves into or how long they were going to be there, the room chosen ment that it cos little or no disruption to anyone, and the food, and more importantly, fags weren’t brought in in sufficent numbers or rationed. What was the point of the occupation? Another photo? It didn’t really disrupt the dept. proceeeings and how many non cfe-usi related students came down to support the occupiers? Surley the thing to do would be to get a large number of people to simultaneously occupy most of the government dept and chaining themselves in order to bring the government to a standstill and then have students (more than a few mates) outside protesting and offering support. But USI would have to try and ring as many of their friends and members of cfe as possible for this to happen – because they don’t engage your average student.

It doesn’t take much for USI to get students involved. Even a forum could be set up on the web site to engage students in discussion about student problems and how to combat them, get students involved in organisng protests, direct action etc and this would only take a few minutes to set up yet Usi haven’t even done this.

Re: usi 'washing its hands' of the possible actions of students.

In my opinion, by doing this USI have lost some of the bargaining power in that they announced that they could not call off or prevent any actions in order to gain concessions with the government. Why should the government be afraid of USI? What has it got to threathen the government with? Occupying a room that doesn’t disturb anything? Letting a few students chain themselves to some railings? No wonder dempseys only met the union twice.

Unless we have a national students union, which actively engages its membership, a union taken serously by the government, we can never expect to really break down the barriers to education at primary, secondary and third level education.

by Umar Tue Aug 12, 2003 00:30

What age are you? You are the only person that comes on every newswire thread and does nothing but hurl abuse at anyone and everyone! What's the point? Strange way to get your kicks!

by James Redmond - Socialist Alternative Tue Aug 12, 2003 21:06 antrophe at hotmail dot com

Gaz posted a link to an older version of this, below is a rough hatchet job update of the article to incorporate the crisis that emerged as college ended, the ministers announcememt and so on.

For those of you not arsed reading it online, a version should be appearing in a zine/alternative freshers guide type thingy some of us are currenty putting together. Keep an eye out.

Beyond Protest Towards Resistance.

It's been something of a heady year in UCD, sometimes it feels like everything has happened so fast that a year has passed in a month. Then at other times it seems that those of us active in UCD are leaving this year with the experiences and memories of more than one year. It is difficult to have anything resembling an accurate mental chronology of it in my head. There exists just some vague collage of activity and the ensuing ups and downs. One of the lessons to draw from this is the need to archive and preserve what is happening around us, not out of any sense of egotism or over estimation of our own importance, but because of the need to pass on a legacy of struggle to future activists, no matter how big or insignificant the success or failure, a repository of method and struggle can only advance.

With the advent of the internet in recent years and the increased computer literacy of activists there is a ready made medium of preservation through websites and independent media outlets. Perhaps one of our first and most lasting mistakes was not to utilise these ready made tools which have proven to facilitate and solidify the growth of student activist groups on the continent.

Much of the inspiration behind the CFE (note the Campaign for Free Education in the republic of Ireland is not linked to the CFE in the UK) came from such internet sites and archives, from the development of autonomous student movements which have been developing on the continent in the past few years. The waves of protest which swept the continent in March 2001, as students in networks like the European Education is Not For Sale Network (http://www.education-is-not-for-sale.org) communicated across borders, through the internet to mobilise against the EU Summit in Seville and the creeping corporate take over of education prompted an examination of the failures of the Irish Student movement.

One could only reach the conclusion that there was no real solid basis in Irish campuses for the formation of such a movement. The task was and still is to build one. What exists are fragmented ecological groups and left wing political groups which spout the slogans of the anti-capitalist movement but decapitate the spirit of autonomy and of grass roots organisation which provide the movements backbone, allowing it to grow organically and at a pace it can sustain itself. The importance of these waves of protests and on how they provided an ideological basis for the formation of the CFE can not be underestimated. Many of the activists involved in the early stages of the campaign were hardened campus activists from UCD, basing much of their energies in efforts like Global Action, which had started in an effort to bring some of the momentum of the anti-capitalist movement abroad to UCD. When news of the planned European Days of Action against the Salmanca Education Summit reached us through email lists, discussions broke out about attempting to organise solidarity actions in UCD.

There was no atmosphere for mobilisations, so ideas focused on propaganda stunts to introduce Irish students to the adverse affects of globalisation on an ideological basis, ideas ranged from banner drops to setting up toll booths in college buildings demanding tuition fees from passing students. However the energy simply wasn't there, and the day of action fell on a college break, so it would have been a futile attempt.

Since Genoa a massive attempt had been made by the Irish left to artificially import anti-capitalism to Ireland, and UCD was no different, on-campus campaigns focussed mostly on the abstract, with no real conception of the interaction between international issues and their manifestation at a local level, so despite constant arguments no real attempt had been made by campus activists to reach out to students.
Sometimes, this process simply requires the jettisoning of the activist vocabulary in favour of that of the everyday, it is impossible to defeat globalisation, who wants to smash the letters W,T and O, they are simply letters, an abstraction, but it is possible to defeat and rally students around the very real consequences of globalisation, such as fees and educational cutbacks. In effect for activists in UCD, the rise in capitation fees prompted a serious consideration of the slogan ‘think global and act local.’

If the CFE in UCD has been a part of a slow process of once again legitimising student mobilisation and direct action as a tactic within the student movement, then the starting point for this process in UCD began with the passing of a motion calling for a demonstration for a better grant at student council in 2002. The motion was put forward by a coalition of independent socialists, Socialist Youth and members of what is now Socialist Alternative. The protest was a damp affair, but empowering none the less for those involved, it showed a way forward outside the ridiculous voter registration and Pat The Politician affair of USI. There was a conscious effort even then to link up the derisory grant payment with the spectre of fees, which could really only be identified through international trade agreements and the Skilbeck Report.

The next time you receive official documentation from your college in regards free fees, please note the manner in which ‘free’ is enclosed in quotation marks. If bureaucracy can afford a sense of sarcasm when dealing with the issue, then its about time we realise, students have had the piss taken out of us for years. The government bureaucracy itself can recognise the fallacy of free education and we do very little to address the dichotomy between ideal and real which effects each and every one of us. So, when the 69% increase in registration fees was announced in July, none of us should have been surprised. GATS had long been swimming around with the rest of those acronyms which make up the activists alphabet soup of IMF, WTO, WEF and so on, but the practical significance of these letters had yet to be realised.

The worlds leaders have decided that it is business and not citizens which will dictate the future of public services. The World Trade Organization's General Agreement On Trade In Services (GATS) wants the government to surrender public services to a private sector where the sole concern is the creaming off of profit with scant regard for the needs of students and the tax payer.

The EU commission describes GATS as 'first and foremost an instrument for the benefit of business'. Business Lobbyists use the disturbing argument that 'schools will respond better to paying customers like any other business'. The US business lobby is highly critical of the 'culture of laziness which continues in the European education system 'where students take liberties to pursue subjects not directly related to industry. Instead they are pursuing subjects which have no practical application'. The governments and the global business elite behind GATS want an education system intricately linked to the market and profit. The removal of "barriers’’ to trade in education services will lead to massive cutbacks in Higher Education. The GATS negotiations aim to remove barriers to free trade in order to give foreign competitors equal access to the Irish education `market'. Barriers cited by the WTO include "the existence of government monopolies and high subsidisation of local institutions’’. Free fees for undergraduates and the grant are 'discriminatory payments' and face the axe under GATS.

Here in Ireland we have already fallen victim to the first step in this process with the rolling back of free fees introduced in 1996 and a massive 69% hike in registration. A year ago only the obscure Skilbeck report carried out by the Government's 'Higher Educational Authority' hinted at the direction education here was being pushed in. Suddenly in the space of a few months, public discourse was pushed by the government towards things that were previously unthinkable, the abolition of the grant, re-introduction of full tuition fees, increased links with industry and increased business funding of education. Creating a closed education system, and one totally geared to meeting the needs of big business. In schools, Public Private Partnerships (PPP) are already in action across Ireland, where taxpayers money is used to start up projects before handing them over to the private sector where profit is siphoned off. The end result of this would be a situation any public education that remained would be forced into constant competition with the private sector, leading to funding cutbacks and colleges about as accessible as Tony O'Reilly Hall is to UCD students.
In North America, especially in Canada, this neo-liberalism is being enthusiastically embraced by political elites as a panacea to the social ills of the country. Ontario in particular has slashed expenditure for health, education and social welfare, similar to the current Irish experience, all under the guise of fiscal discipline. The end result of this has been a dramatic increase in fees. Some estimates place the cost of attending college at an average 20%-25% of the average family income, it must also be remembered that at the same time the average family income has not increased, while the cost of basic educational materials like texts and so on has increased drastically. The inability of the family to subsidise education forces a majority of students to depend upon borrowed money particularly from government sponsored student loans. Students there now graduate not only with degrees but with an average $30,000 debt, with few prospects for well paid employment forcing increasing numbers to declare personal bankruptcy as the only means to cope with the financial pressure.

When the ministers announcement came in July, the only response it received from our representatives in USI was a press statement of condemnation, it was this failure to respond and inadequacy which prompted the formation of the Campaign For Free Education. It was implausible that we could rely upon USI and our own union to represent us, when USI did respond, it repeated the photo opportunities of three years ago, dumping a pile of ducks in the Liffey. One other effort to raise the issue in the media was the hand cuffing of student union leaders to the Dails gates, before helpfully unlocking themselves after a symbolic period of time. These rare tokenistic acts were wholly insufficient.
The first meeting was called together in the space of a week organised by Socialist Alternative, Socialist Youth and a labour party activist. A number of students from Dublin colleges attended and discussed the formation of a campaign. Global Action had been discussing organising a student anti-capitalist conference that summer. The idea never got off the ground. But its basic premise was adopted by the CFE to get activists together and form a network in preparation for September. Speakers were organised, but unfortunately, due to logistics the meeting never took place. At the same time about 800 stickers were put up around the city’s colleges in an effort to get people involved.
One of the first mistakes we overcame was a reliance upon the existing left as a temporary basis and core for the campaign. Despite several weeks of effort in terms of trying to establish a campaign in as many Dublin campuses as a possible, there was no real response from anybody outside of UCD, reconciled to this isolation, we retreated and began the process of organising in our own campus.

The CFE was consciously set up with the immediate aim of mobilising students and involving them collectively in building mass resistance to not just a rise in registration fees, but against educational inequality. In terms of public discourse, the issue facing the student movement at the moment is not the 69% increase, this is just a symptom of a wider problem. The government has long since shifted debate, it has covered itself in the language of social inclusion, a stance which has contributed to the idea of students as some selfish middle class elite out to safe guard our own privileged existence in campuses which remain no go areas for a vast majority of young people.

A meeting was organised on campus and attended by about 30 people. Widespread discussion was held on the course of action, occupations, motorway blockades and marches. An all important activist list was formed, which proved essential .
But the moment which decisively shaped the campaign came when rumours abounded that Noel Dempsey was opening the new arts annex in the first week, with about 12 hours to mobilise, a number of us ran around frantically on campus shouting at students through a mega phone, for some reason they responded. The minister never showed up, but Brian Lenihan did and was duly received with a sit down blockade of the building by about 60 students, the cops were forced to drag many of us out of the way and the ensuing national and campus media coverage only raised the profile of the campaign within the college if not nationally.

This first action was decisive for two reasons. One, while in the past there had been attempts to organise impromptu protests they usually involved the left attempting to mobilise the left, here for the first time in years was a clear attempt to mobilise students not activists. Also this was not just a demonstration of anger, it saw a return to the politics of direct action and confrontation which if anything defines the CFE. Instead of creating spectacle and photo opportunities, the protest had an immediate goal which could be achieved to block Fianna Fails access to our campus in the exact same way in which they were blocking ours. If they create financial barriers, then we could just as easily create physical ones. For the first few months the slogan 'they block our access, we block theirs’ provided the impetus for the movement in the college.

The next day USI with several members of the CFE occupied the department of education. Those of us who occupied from UCD did so because we believed Bertie Ahearn was visiting UCD the same day and protests on campus were being organised, we hoped simultaneous protests in UCD and the occupation would provide impetus to other student actions elsewhere. Unfortunately, the USI occupation despite its success in terms of creating a media frenzy, did little to mobilise and empower students. Those students who did come down to support the occupation, came only to watch and support and were not encouraged by USI to take action themselves. They were congratulated and applauded, then they went home. CFE activists who were also outside the department gates distributed leaflets and formed activists lists in an effort to spread CFE elsewhere. When the police did 'smash the student siege' CFE activists organised blockades of the department gates, forcing the cops to release the occupiers through a side exit, rather than arrest them. On a bizarre Monthly Pythonesque note, a day or so after the protest I got a phone call from the USI deputy president, I was to meet him in town, where I was duly requested to dress up as a cowboy for the Star's short lived 'Free Education' campaign. I duly declined. This incident alone probably highlights USI's failings, any publicity is good publicity, even if it serves only to make a farce of any student movement, and further provoke snorts of derision from the student body.

Early in the year we also used the class rep elections as a platform for our ideas on campus, seeing 21 people who stood on a platform of free education, collective mass action against fees and reclaiming the students’ union being elected. This was not just about occupying seats in a council, but a political stunt within itself. It represented an attempt to reclaim the union. The hacks that dominate the union do so through isolating the student body from the democratic process, by clouding it and simply not postering for things like council elections. Most students in UCD don't know who their reps are, because their reps never seek a mandate, they just sneak in by getting a few mates to vote in an election nobody knows is happening. By actually seeking a mandate and by actually postering and leafleting for our candidates, explaining ourselves in front of lectures, we tried to return council to the general student body, by acknowledging their existence and actually recreating the democratic process, forcing other candidates to do likewise.
The months to come would see larger on campus demonstrations, including two days of protest where a motorway outside UCD was blockaded after more than 250 students had marched through all the faculty buildings. Building for these demos provided a further platform for the campaign to explain itself, carrying out stalls and mass leafleting. Attempts were made to occupy admin and O'Reilly Hall, but marching on both shouting 'O-C-C-U-PY! What We Gonna Do? OCCUPY!' was probably a tactical error, if anything. The following day after the first day of action more than 300 gathered in an impromptu blockade of the education minister in the Vet Building through a combination of sit downs and the erection of barricades. The Vet building protest is probably one of the most inspirational protest I've taken part in in Ireland. Its not just an urban myth that UCD is designed to counter student protests. The barricades by security at the entrance to the building, were reinforced with concrete blocks which fit into the design scheme of the building, attempts were made to rip the barricades down, very minor shoving matches broke out with services, but they weren't budging and neither were the barricades.

Some of us then put forward the idea that we all jump them on the count of three, everybody agreed, and on three we all jumped and charged the door, blocking it with a sit down. We had the numbers so split up to block other exits. Sit-downs blocked the other doors and barricades of rubble were erected at side exits to prevent the minister's car leaving the college, locks had been placed on the buildings gates. No person was able to enter the building without the approval of the students at the entrances. For 2 hours the minister was prevented leaving. The college authorities had to sneak the minister out in a jeep hidden around the back of the building. It was a refreshing sight to see students roaming around campus gathering rocks for a barricade, shoving skips up against doors. The mainstream media chose to ignore the protest, when I rang RTE, I was told 'you are a disgrace'. That said station then hung up on me. We had also unwittingly trapped a camera man in the building!
One feature of the protest was the role of the Students' Union officers. Most of them stood on a hill near by, smiling coyly. Abey Cambell, the vice president when asked by the college media why he was there rather than express support he just said 'because the sky is blue.' However most anger was directed at Aonghus Hourihane, the SU President. Hourihane walked by the protest earlier in the day and went into the building to have cheese and wine with the minister. After the demo a large group of students marched into the Union Corridor in a very confrontational protest to demand a stance against fees, some of the sabats locked their doors, and in a moment perhaps symbolic of the state of the union called security on us. In retrospect, it would have been more constructive to forget about the union at that moment, we had shattered all illusions in it at that point. We should have just taken over part of the student centre and held a meeting there. A large meeting of students planning direct action in something resembling St Stephen's Green Shopping Centre would have been an act of reclamation and propaganda by deed that would have spoken volumes in itself
An opinion poll carried out by the College Tribune saw 76% of students support the CFE, while 90% opposed fees, all at a time where our union even refused to take a position on fees. A student union council meeting then voted to condemn the actions of the CFE at the Vet building blockade, in a motion put forward by a vet class rep. In the SU election later in the year, the general body of vet students would overwhelmingly support Paul Dillon, an activist with the CFE who won the presidents election and was known as an organiser of the blockade.

There was one other organised day of action on campus including lecture boycotts, marches on administration demanding a retraction of their support for fees, an occupation of the department of finance and numerous impromptu protests blockading government representatives from coming into Society organised debates and pissing off a load of hacks in the process. While the first day of action had been a success, the second one did not go as well. About 200 took part in the mobilisation, but it some how seemed a failure, unlike the protests where direct action took place had taken place there was no sense of immediate victory. It was originally conceived as something of a 'Reclaim Education' party on campus, but despite our successes we were probably over stretching ourselves here and simply didn't have the resources to pull it off. Another factor mitigating against the action was the USI disaffiliation referendum which took place around the same time, a lot of CFE activists were caught up in fighting this campaign, which won overwhelmingly on the slogan 'No to fees, no to disaffiliation.'

At the end of most of the large campus based mobilisations mass meeting of around a hundred people took place in lecture theatres we took over in the arts block after the demo, on regret from the year is not coming up with an organisational method to utilise these meetings more and build upon them as a solid basis for building a mass campaign of hundreds of activists. In retrospect it is easy and frustrating to identify mistakes, but you learn and progress in the course of events.

An occupation was planned for the day before the FF-PD Budget, and before USI's protest on the day. In the morning protesters occupied the Office of PD Junior Minister Tom Parlon, in the Department of Finance. 12 students were involved in the occupation, seven of which are involved in the UCD Campaign for Free Education. The others were from Maynooth, we had formed contacts with them through the earlier occupation. CFE has made a conscious effort all year, to break out of UCD and form links with students elsewhere. In UCD CFE has constantly built for USI demos and thrown our resources into getting students out to them in extremely difficult circumstances. At the demos themselves we have always operated as a block in an effort to organise mass direct action. At the first USI demo this year, we occupied the department of transport for a while with other students.

Our most successful action to date was at the February 5th demo. The last time we gathered outside government buildings to oppose fees, we were told to go home and write letters to our local TD, as a result the march barely made the news. At the demonstration the CFE were determined to organise real action against the government, as USI mouthed off from a truck, quite similar to the one the cops had used to block our path to the Dail at the last demo, we were organising direct action and involving students in the process. As USI told us to go home, 2 seperate blocks ran past cops and barricades and blocked the front of the dail for over two hours in a sit down protest. Despite threats of arrest under the public order act, a mass decision was made by the 300 students not to move. Eventually the police were forced to physically remove us from the road.

While the distractions of USI a referendum and the student union election pushed the CFE away from on campus mobilisations through sheer exhaustion of its members, the biggest factor mitigating against the rising tide of militancy was its isolation within UCD. While other campuses expressed interest in the campaign, they were unwilling to overlook the activist ghetto and mobilise outside in the student body. In a way UCD was a unique situation, a union dominated by Fianna Fail created a situation where grass roots organisation had to take place as the only way forward. In other campuses, unions dominated by liberals are only too willing to organise protests and pay radical lip service when government ministers visit, but there is an unwillingness on the behalf of the left to call action over their heads. In the moment no one considers jumping the barricades collectively and doing something a little more than waving a placard behind crowd control barriers. In student politics there are also the radical insurrectionists, who see the government been beaten through the actions of a handful of students and their heroics, chained to gates and holed up in government buildings, these usually go hand in hand with the liberal union types. Plans are made in the bar that invariably never are put into action. No attempt is made to reach out to others through organisation, a hierarchy of a clique of friends exists which isolates the activists further from the student body and mobilisations and collective actions of the mass of students are not considered. Usually they dismiss the mass as 'apathetic.' An illusion that things can be done through the existing unions to mobilise students, persists and grass roots organisation is not considered as a means forward.

Students as a social body are prepared and conditioned to postpone their frustrations with declining living standards until they make the transition to full employment, they see the major problems and issues of student life as transitory problems and postpone any attempt to engage the issue head on, instead seeing it as easier solved by diverting their energies into seeking an individual solution to the barriers in front of them such as taking a part time job. But now there is a need to recognise the threat posed by the direction Irish education is being pushed in. The reintroduction of fees, under whatever guise it was presented would not only have eroded the living standards of students but presents a threat to the very right of access to higher education.

Activism cannot and must not exist in a vacuum. In order for the activist strategy to foster change it must exist outside the actual event. What we are fighting for must be bigger than what we place ourselves in immediate opposition to, this means realising what the whole picture is before focussing on the smaller. Approaching things from the bottom up, instead of seeking to chip away at the symptoms. We need to broaden our objectives as a movement and tackle educational inequality in the education system as a whole, as opposed to obvious issues like fees and an inadequate grant. Educational inequality manifests itself in secondary, where access to higher level is determined by such simple facts as whether or not a student stays in school long enough to finish the leaving cert.

As the recent spate of anti-war walkouts how, there is a serious need to create a student movement across the board, which stretches into the secondary schools, we need to actively encourage activism in the secondary schools and promote the ideas of grass roots organisation. This can not be done on the basis of college students leading the way forward, but only through the autonomous formation of activist groups in schools which then network and co-operate with the student movement on an equal footing.

While the election of CFE activists to the UCD SU is an extremely progressive step which will greatly facilitate action against the government next year, this does not represent an end within itself. Taking a union should not be end game for the CFE. There is still an need for the formation of a grass roots student movement in this country, which can operate on two fronts, against the government and against union leaderships which refuse to act.

In addition to the political function of the unions, they fill the role of service provider on campus, further requiring co-operation and a cordial relationship with the authorities which limits a real ability to fight for change. The role of the union as an agent of social change becomes undermined, as its attempts to tackle on campus problems such as food prices is limited to providing alternative food outlets which enter into competition with those businesses the college has allowed on campus, the logic is that free market economics will drive the price of food on campus down.

Students Unions are dependent upon the college administration to collect their dues and there have been cases where universities have silenced radical unions by simply refusing to do this. Often unions are expected to provide answers to the problems of the college authorities. Their role is wrought with contradictions, currently they mainly see their role as 'representing the views' of students, suggesting these student leaders do not have to combat the politically problematic issues faced by students, but simply to repeat them in media press releases.

Radical student unions cannot exist where there is no radical student body. To move towards activist based student unions willing to take stands for students, rather than remaining neutral, making finances available to grass roots initiatives-those running for office will have to come from a student movement which does not wholly exist here yet. A student movement can not be created or formed from the top down, it can only grow from the base. Our job as students is to create such a movement here.

The problems facing students and those who wish to attend third level now such as accommodation and the general rising cost of attending college pose a collective problem and as such they demand a collective solution. The CFE aims to operate as a grass roots network of students, seeking to mobilise students collectively against barriers to access in education and also to mobilise opinion against the ideological arguments being presented as a justification for attacks on education. Direct action is not an empty slogan, instead it fundamentally represents the desire for a direct collective response, and action on the issues facing us. Direct action as a philosophy of empowerment, we neither seek to create or engage in the heroic spectacle of a few activists taking action on all of our behalf's. The direct action we advocate is a breaking down of barriers erected by those who insist upon representing and acting on our behalf. Why mobilise students as some army of extras in the background of media photographs, as those taking the foreground posture half-heartedly on our behalf before telling us to go home and write letters of protest?

Such actions, while useful, will not alone be able to sort out the major issues confronting us. Direct action puts all students in the foreground of the photo, empowering them to organise collectively themselves in whatever sphere they operate in.

As the college term broke up, those of us involved thought the possibilities for action would collapse, but as the issue of fees gained momentum in the press, so did we. Typical of USI, a number of us were rang and told to head into town the following day, action was planned. Interestingly enough, they refused to divulge what was planned and just expected us to show up and join in. A handful of USI types and one or two CFE-ers handcuffed themselves to the Dail gates, while others occupied a ministerial building.

Later in the day the Department of transport was occupied over night. The actions suggested to me nothing more than an attempt by USI to create the illusion of a student movement and action, when in reality all the actions that took place that day formed around less than 20 people. The refusal to discuss what was planned, meant it was impossible for CFE to mobilise itself for them. Taking part in the Transport building occupation was depressing. Lack of preparation led to a situation where some of those involved had no idea of what entails an occupation, the use of a room or building as a negotiating tool. So as the action became prolonged, you could see people begin to lose their cool, and argue for leaving.

People screaming that we were out of food is definitely not conducive to forcing the state to end the protest and embarrass it self on the issue. Certainly, this confusion came from USI, where the occupation is seen as a tool towards media coverage, rather than as something to contribute to the building of a movement, the idea that we may be forced to stay overnight never entered their heads, never mind the desire to. Occupying, a tiny first aid room which generally isn’t used is also ill advised if you want to directly disrupt the business of the building. The fact that the occupation lasted over night is not a victory, but a recognition of the fact that the police just left us in there to stew until we decided to leave the next morning.
After this, CFE agreed to act unilaterally and began to organise two days of escalating protests in the city centre.

Rather than contract, the CFE began to expand with parents attending our meetings and a number of new faces showing up. Colm Jordan had issued a ridiculous statement wiping his hands clean of students who may take further action against the government. Rather than being a veiled threat, I think it’s more apt to read such a statement as the organisation washing it’s hands of the issue, it had no strategy and after the handcuffing and occupations a few days earlier it had exhausted what it had seen as its radical method. The President of USI mooted the idea of mass non-payment, but such a campaign can not be created through releasing a press release to the media. USI is happy to channel dissent into channels sanctioned by the state, through forms of protest it can contain or watch USI contain for them. We need to organise groups and networks within and without our colleges so that we can act collectively and respond when the government attacks us.

We need to legitimise direct action as a form of protest within the student movement. Students should wait no longer stop postponing victories, take every victory presenting itself on all levels, embarrass and harass the government into submission by denying its representatives access to our campuses in the same way it seeks to deny our access. As well as responding to the government through reactive demonstrations and protests we also need to take proactive steps, forcing the government to respond to our agenda of change and desires instead of seeking to tweak theirs.

It had reached a stage where CFE’s plans for protests were being covered in the front page of the Irish Times. We were gearing up for a substantial confrontation at a difficult juncture; outside of the college term.

And so we won then, did we? The announcement came that the minister had collapsed to pressure from within the government and a €42 million package was being prepared to substantially raise the grant threshold levels. The planned series of protests were cancelled after an awkward phone poll of CFE activists. Some of us argued that the protests should continue, that we could redirect the momentum and anger of fees towards the unresolved issue of the axed Summer Student Job Scheme (SSJS) and the slashing of the Back to Education Allowance (BTEA). Unfortunately, we were in a small minority. Fees are not being re-introduced and once again there is a need to re-evaluate the student movement, to discover how we can move on to tackling the more awkward and less sexy issues of SSJS and BTEA, linking up with cutbacks elsewhere. CFE once again faces into an awkward period, next September will decide it’s future, if it will continue or fade away. One thing that has to be realised is that as activists we are all tied to the mood of those around us no matter how hard we struggle. Then of course there is the other issue that the majority of those who would benefit from such a campaign, are those who are outside of college, looking in. Those that can't afford to attend, and those that drop out of secondary. How is it possible to forge links between these and the current student movement? It’s harder to build a mass campaign around something like the BTEA which affects a relatively small number. Especially when many of those involved may drop out of activism. We have yet to see if €42 million is the price of our silence, or whether or not we move on to further action over educational disadvantage. Whatever happens, I think the most beneficial thing CFE did was to re-introduce the politics of self organisation and direct action to the student movement.

by Noel Hogan Wed Aug 13, 2003 16:37

"Wrong, we’re fighting against all barriers to education. We’ve ‘won’ on the fees issue, this alone is not going to significantly improve the numbers of diadvantaged students entering third level education. With the spotlight on education over the past year the opportunity to widen the argument on how to really help the disadvantaged, and move it away simply from fees, imho was largely missed."

No Problem there, I agree with you. And USI's policies on this are pretty clear. I Only said fees as shorthand to illustrate that the fight is with Government, not each other. But there are a few reasons that fees became the big issue last year. Last year's National Campaign had 5 aims, of which fees was just one. Accomodation was another, Grants another and also the return of the Medical Card to all students. All our marches, protests and demos were done with that in mind. But what did the media want to talk about? Fees, fees, fees and little else. We made placards for each of our demos, with some saying "stop fees", some saying "more grants", some saying "More accommodation", "stop BTEA cutbacks" and so fourth. But open any paper and you'll see someone holding a placard saying "no fees", to the exclusion of anything else.

- I agree with your points on the other cutbacks, and USI was campaigning on them as well. My point is to stop fees and get €40+ million for access in one year is a success for one year's work. This year's crew can build on that, and so on. No, we didn't achieve a utopian education system in one year, but it can be done in a few, that's the way I look at it. So in the context of one year's work, it was successful.


"If you really want organisations like cfe springing up around the country then why don’t you actively encourage it, give them some small funding so they can print flyers, posters etc until they can become self sufficient and raise funds themselves."

- I would have done, if I had been asked. For example, the planned CFE mass demo in May I would have been happy to help out at, provide posters etc. But I read the minutes of a meeting held after occupation of Transport, when the mass demo was planned, and it said "ignore USI", so when I saw that I said "fair enough". All it took was a phone call or an email from someone in CFE to say "Noel, can you make up a few posters/loan us a few megaphones" etc. and I would have helped no problem. But nobody called.

"Like cfe said, if the government continues to block students access to college, then students should block their access to colleges. It doesn’t take much to organise a protest at the arrival of a member of the government. A mass protest is welcome and has a part to play but it must be combined with sustained activity."

- No problem there, I and other officers were well pleased to see that happen (hey, it was in the review of the year video at congress). I was at NCI to help with the protest against McCreevy as well. The only CFE action all year that I had a prob with was the sit down on Kildare street, and I've already explained my reasons there.


"Chaining yourself to some railings for a few minutes,as you’ve stated in this thread, shows that only a minority of students care. Its yet another photo op and no real attempt to piss off the government."
- It's also an attempt to build awareness among students. At the start of year, consciousness was fairly low, as I'm sure you agree. So we said over the summer to go for some high profile tactics, both to embarrass the government and raise student awareness of the campaign through the media. Hence the chaining protests, occupation of dept of ed, etc.

That brings me on to something else. USI was criticised on many occasions this year for just looking for media attention for our campaign. Indeed it was part of our strategy, particularly in the summer. For a very simple reason, we were trying to raise consciousness, and how else are students supposed to hear about student protests during the summer months except through the media. I've seen it written that USI don't want to raise student awareness, we just want publicity.

Well, how the fuck were we supposed to raise awareness of the National Campaign among students during the summer if it wasn't through the media and getting publicity for our actions? The colleges are closed, students are dispersed around the country. There's only one way to communicate with them, and that was to use the media to our benefit. If we didn't do that, we would have had an even tougher job trying to get students on the streets come october.


"Surley the thing to do would be to get a large number of people to simultaneously occupy most of the government dept and chaining themselves in order to bring the government to a standstill and then have students (more than a few mates) outside protesting and offering support. But USI would have to try and ring as many of their friends and members of cfe as possible for this to happen – because they don’t engage your average student."

Plus I don't have contact details for the average student. And very few officers from SUs around the country were willing to undertake occupations. A lamentable state of affairs, but not something I (or officer board) was responsible for. I contacted every SU in the country prior to that sit in, but very few were willing to do it. I'd have no problem with mass occupations, but I didn't have the power to deliver the numbers needed.

"It doesn’t take much for USI to get students involved. Even a forum could be set up on the web site to engage students in discussion about student problems and how to combat them, get students involved in organisng protests, direct action etc and this would only take a few minutes to set up yet Usi haven’t even done this."

- We did have a student forum before, unfortunately we almost got sued over an incident of impersonation, where someone from the North logged in as the Queens SU President, and proceeded to libel people left right and centre. Now there's loads of student forums (sin.ie, tcdsu.org etc) so I'm sure they could be used in that way. Although I'd be wary about posting details of upcoming direct actions on the internet, for obvious reasons.
In any event, every poster that usi did this year had my email address (campaigns@usi.ie) and encouraged people to get involved.

"Unless we have a national students union, which actively engages its membership, a union taken serously by the government, we can never expect to really break down the barriers to education at primary, secondary and third level education."

- So why not get involved and help build it up? I'm sure this year's Campaigns Officer would welcome the help. We both want the same thing in the end.

by conor {a.k.a mr whinebag} - ORGANISATION - very nearly the name of new0rders 9th album. Thu Aug 14, 2003 17:22 conor at ziplip dot com horray - noelser for "prime minister"

Jusus. 5 ? days on, and this thread is still going? - it seems indymedia have a new editorial "policy" which results in relentless debates.

i couldnt give a fuck - quite honestly - although i aggree wityh reddy and gaz and cian, but not noel ( at least while he still looks like a white zimbabwian land owner )

to me the student movement can be split into 2 broad sections - (1)the politicised and (2)non - politicised political . the politicised can be split into 2 main groups, - (a)those who are ideologically right wing, and aggree with government policy, and (b) those who are left wing ,want to work in the union , change it from the inside out.

the non politicised can be split up into 2 main camps (note - all splitting is in degrees of green, not red) (x) the non politicised political, who note, and treat with caution , but work alingside group (1b), and (y)the non politicised, who prefair other things to student protests, but will turn up for the bit of craic with their mates, ministerial namecalling , and (hopefully) some aggro with the gardai.

as someone who is no longer has any of the cridentials outlined for any of the above groups(along with the 95% of students whoose minds ive read - noelser), i guess noel is right. im just a moaney bollox who (for being a general ass) has to repeat exams, and therefore enjoys going online to slag off group (1b) - by far and away the easiest to get the banter out of.

so now im "dropping out" of all college related discussions, because ..........

(btw - james , i made you that tape, and will get it to you somehow , email me your address. i diddnt know exactly what to put on it, but i thought you said durutti column / kraftwerk would do)

SHIT - that was a bit cliquey and elitest. fuck.

{ http::/www.massmovementon.imc/not-happening }

by conor - not ant more Thu Aug 14, 2003 17:31

i dont represent the cfe or sa , as i am no longer a member of either group.

{ thats just so mr (insert fake name here) - sp , dosent come on taking the crazze sheeit ive just been blathering on about as being sa policy, or anysuch nonsense. its just the rantings of an isolated former leftie about campus. }

by Curious Thu Aug 14, 2003 18:32

Whats Oisin doing for the UCDSU? Why does he spend allof his time working for the SP? His office is like a Trotsky shrine, with reams of SP and CWI propagana on this desk which he tries to force on any unfortunates who enter his office.

We are paying for this farce! Recall Oisin Kelly now!

by Noel - from the hills of Tibet. Thu Aug 14, 2003 18:56

I also couldn't give a fuck anymore. Hurrah! Now I'm off to shovel some yak shit in my little mountain farm and keep Conor happy.

Bye bye.

by conor Thu Aug 14, 2003 19:57 conor at ziplip dot com

now that that us students have 1 less scab.

hopefully its just a begining. my first piece of good news since i thought i heard jakob nielson say " combovers are so un user friendly "

{of course what jak actually said was , " flash animation is so un user friendly" }

good luck with the shit soveling ..... its a vital public service , and the first worthwhile thing youve bothered to do since ....

COMING UP ......

_______________________________________

"you know what i call the telly .... the idiot box ... thats right , the idiot box" -

never a truer word than those of don tonay, a semi fictional character in a semi - fictional film.

by Noel - from the hills of Tibet. Thu Aug 14, 2003 20:28

...that you're happy Conor. I shall make it my mission in life to please you from now on! The Zimbabwe farmer look is on the way out already.

by conor - usi Thu Aug 14, 2003 21:09 conor at ziplip dot com

Now that youve made it your lifetime vocation to serve me will you:

1)take my money.
2)use it to make a glossy magazine, packed full of "articles" and ads.
3)recreate paris 68 on an exact full scale size , so i can drive round in a citreon DS 21 Cabriolet shouting "fuck the police, fuck the trotskyites, fuck the students union"with a juicy lemon in my mouth.
4)organise a mass protest at the dail so i can listen to the wise words of enda kenny.
5)go have a rant on indymedia or rte or pat kenny or some other wasteful "media" outlet => raising conciousness in usi speak.
6)grovel to mr minister http://www.mugshots.org/misc/bert.html.
7)suffocate any chance of students doing anything autonomious.
8)further your future carreer in fine gael / fianna fail / labour / sinn fein / the green party.
9)dance like will smith.
10)punch yourself in the face.
11)buy a nice rugby shirt.
12)buy a nice brazilian mahogany boardroom and puff away with colm jordan, those "mad bastards" from dit.
13)love maude lebowski.
14)print off a load of bank-card-style-cards so students will realise they actually have a national union.

when youve done all that, you could buy me a couple of "yokes" or whatever they call them these days, yknow to help the exam induced stress, or just leave your computer on and keep responding to the lowest standard writings my mind has produced in a long while .... ya daft punk.

by - - - Fri Aug 15, 2003 17:40

Shut up Regan

by CURIOUS Fri Aug 15, 2003 17:51

RECALL REGAN FOR POSTING UP CRAP ABOUT OTHER OFFICERS ON THIS SITE WHILE UCD STUDENTS ARE PAYING FOR HIS FARCE OF A JOB